Plan for high-speed line Bangkok – Kuala Lumpur
There is no high-speed train operational in Thailand yet, but making plans is a good job for the government. For example, they are now going to discuss with Malaysia about the construction of a high-speed line between Bangkok and Kuala Lumpur.
The idea originally came from the Malaysian minister of transport, but Thailand has listened to it. Thai experts believe that the line can compete with the aircraft and they expect sufficient passengers. Travel time between Bangkok and Kuala Lumpur is estimated at 5 to 6 hours.
The Thai railways (SRT) must now enter into talks with the Malaysians and there will be a meeting of the transport ministers of both countries with this topic as the main item on the agenda.
The first high-speed train to be built is the Bangkok – Hua Hin route (165 km). It will be examined whether the line can be extended to Kuala Lumpur or whether a new direct line of 1.400 km must be built. After the exploratory talks, experts are hired for a feasibility study. Japan and China are interested in building the line.
Malaysia also wants to build a high-speed rail link between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore. Three countries can be connected with the line from Thailand. Laos and China would also be added in the future.
Source: Bangkok Post
You have been traveling for more than 3 hours by plane. In the article they talk about 5 to 6 hours, yes yes!
The distance with the HSL Amsterdam to Paris is over 500 km and takes about 3 1/2 hours. Well then I'll help the Thai authorities calculate: for 1400 km it will take you 10 hours in an efficient country. And in Thailand it will take a bit longer with a high-speed train. Dreaming is allowed and spreading positive messages always works in Thailand.
Do the math again for everyone please: BKK – KL is a flight of less than 2 hours, not 3 hours. The comparison with Amsterdam – Paris is strange; with only 160 km/h the HSL is not a real high speed train and in Japan and China high speed trains do about double that ('Japan and China are interested in building the line') – 5 to 6 hours then indeed . Since it can sometimes be problematic to get in or out of BKK due to traffic and since the airport of KL is located far from the center, the total travel time will not differ much.
yes in Kuala Lumpur it is 1 hour later , but the flight time from Malaysia , Thai, Air Asia etc. is about 2 hours and 15 minutes.
And the main route in Japan by train is from Tokyo to Osaka and takes at least 2 1/2 hours over a distance of 515 , which is comparable to the distance from Amsterdam to Paris. However, it remains that the distance from Bangkok to Kuala Lumpur is 1400 km and then also some more stops along the way and then under comparable optimal conditions one is still on the road for 7 1/2 hours. But this is Thailand and the circumstances are different so just add a few hours and you will arrive at 10 hours on the road.
Hi Ger,
these plans have been around for a while and are being boosted from China. China eventually wants to extend this line to Australia.
China also has plans to extend the Laos branch to India, Arabian Peninsula (and then Africa) and eventually to Europe.
In addition, there is a Chinese plan to build a high-speed train to Canada!
If China has its way, you should not think of an HSL because that is actually a medium-speed line. China is focusing on a kind of bullet train variant as a starter.
Thailand and Malaysia are not that far yet, so they are going for a medium-speed line for the time being.
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@Ger, that just depends on how often you stop and which part is actually HSL. On the route you mentioned, the last part from Brussels South to Paris Nord is 300 km long and is driven in 1 hour and 20 minutes (the last part of it into Paris takes at least 20-25 minutes), so the other 2 hours are about the first 200 km. With only stops in Hua Hin and Surat Thani, for example, this seems really feasible to me, especially given the advancing technology on the track and the increasingly faster equipment, average speeds of more than 300 km/h are becoming the rule rather than the exception.
If you want to achieve those (dream) travel times, a completely new line is inevitable. This line will therefore have to pass through the southern provinces, which are then susceptible to attacks… Hmmm…
In the meantime, Europe has also built up a network of high-speed lines, which is still being expanded. Those high-speed trains are a success… for 'short' distances, such as (Amsterdam? -) Brussels – Paris, Paris – Frankfurt (?), Brussels / Paris – London or the connections between the largest cities in France, Spain and Italy.
I believe many people take the high speed train for distances between roughly 300km to 1000km (rough estimate). For shorter distances, people take the regular (international) trains. In Thailand, most people travel by bus.
But for longer distances, such as from Amsterdam or Brussels to Barcelona, Madrid, Milan or Rome (to name just a few), most people still take the plane! The plane not only wins over the train here because of the travel times, but also because of the fares! Flying over longer distances within Europe is (much) cheaper than traveling by train!
I fear that this scenario will also apply to Asia.
People will continue to take buses for shorter distances and planes for longer distances.
The Thai government will first have to invest in a sound domestic rail network, which can then also be (partially) used for high-speed trains. Incidentally, this domestic network is also necessary for the connection of most cities with the high-speed line. What is the point if people have to travel a long distance (by bus) before they can take the high-speed train? In addition, none of the 3 major bus stations in Bangkok are in close proximity to Bangkok's main station! Khon Kaen Bus Station is also some distance away from Khon Kaen Railway Station. I suspect that is the case in most Thai cities. I believe this is also a problem that the government needs to think about and find a solution to;
And you also have to make the Thai discover the train and learn to travel by train…
Wow, still a long journey to go and many obstacles to clear!
Calculate:
The construction costs of similar lines in Thailand are estimated at 500 million baht per kilometer, 12.5 million euros. So for 1400 kilometers 700 billion Baht, 17.5 billion euros.
For a return on investment of 1%, a profit of 175 million euros must be made annually, 500.000 euros per day. To generate that in turnover alone, you must have 50 travelers per day, 10.000 per direction, at a price of 5.000 euros per single journey (slightly more expensive than cheap flying).
There are now about 23 flights per day from Bangkok to Kuala Lumpur, at 200 persons per plane, which is 4600 per day and that apparently meets the demand.
Even if you were to get everyone who is now traveling by plane onto the train, you would still be short of passengers. And then I have not even included the costs of trains, personnel, electricity and maintenance, the entire turnover in my calculation goes to the fictitious investor, who is satisfied with a 1% return.
The conclusion is that the train is therefore more expensive than flying and that it takes about 7 hours longer.
And those in the know know that another high-speed line, Bangkok to Vientiene, Laos, has not yet been completed as there is no agreement on the fee for the loan amount, around 3%. So the 1% return should actually be about 3 percent, fee for borrowing.
The article says something about Thai 'experts' thinking it is feasible. I would advise the minister to first have these Thai people take a course in business economics abroad: send them by plane to Kuala Lumpur or Singapore.
Will never become profitable and the big loser is nature, the necessary square kilometers of jungle will have to be cut down and cut in half for such a prestige project.
In other words, not doing it will only cost you a lot of money and you can already get a return ticket BKK-Kl for a sloppy 2000 bth. When I hear that you have to pay around 1000 bth for a boat trip from Pattaya to Hua Hin, I don't want to know what a train ticket will cost.
Yes, I think those experts want to join the committee that is to do the feasibility study. In my cursory route over the internet to obtain the data for my calculation, I had already come across that such a committee for a different route, including the environmental report, thinks it needs four years already. How do you keep yourself working?
For the very long term, a fast land connection on electricity instead of fossil fuel is of course an option. Then you should think more of such a kind of pneumatic mail train at low pressure, which goes 1000 km / h.
To start now on a High Speed Network with more or less conventional trains, the concept of which is almost 200 years old, and where one elephant on the rails means a catastrophe, while it is also unprofitable, seems to me quite hopeless .
Would they have taken into account the travel time, immigration and customs?
You will have to check somewhere when that train crosses the border.