Attestation de Vita
For specific private reasons, I decided to stop working quite a few years before I turned 65. That was possible because I could make use of an early retirement scheme at the pension fund, which I was affiliated with through my employer.
Nothing special in itself, that was all arranged in an orderly manner, with every year I received a letter from the pension fund to check whether I was still alive. This is called an Attestation de Vita, (life certificate) a form on which you fill in your personal data and then have it certified by a competent local authority. You can then certify this at a notary, the town hall, the immigration police or the embassy.
The first time I took the completed form to a large notary office located near me here in Pattaya and for 1100 Baht I got the necessary stamp on the form. I may have visited this office again the following year, but through an acquaintance I came into contact with a small company where two young ladies practiced the notary's profession. Such an official stamp is of course nothing at all and I have since been helped nicely for the sweet sum of 150 Baht.
The first time I got there, I left the form and came back the next day. The notary had filled in everything neatly, but she had filled in the possible date of death in pencil, not sure if that was the intention. I said no, that will not be filled in until I am actually dead and in that case I will come back to you to fill in that date. Humor, which is not with one Thai lady hit!
That first price of 1100 Baht was not really a problem for a few times, but when I turned 65 I was happy that I was now a customer of the notary ladies. In addition to AOW, I now receive a pension from 6 different sources and every pension fund wants such an Attestation de Vita from me every year. To avoid discussion, I'll just say that linking those pensions was impossible in my time, something that seems to be quite normal nowadays. Look, now the price of 1100 or 150 Baht makes a big difference, doesn't it?
Now that I have sent all pension funds the required Attestatie's de Vita, one of them wrote me a letter saying that they would stop doing this. They had concluded an agreement with the Social Insurance Bank (the body responsible for my state pension) and will receive the necessary information from that source. An Attestation de Vita is no longer necessary for them. An excellent arrangement, of which I have informed all other pension funds. One wrote back saying it was an interesting idea, one would study it. If it happens at all, the idea will have to go through many bureaucratic and administrative mills, so a simplification will take some time to come.
The Social Insurance Bank also requires such a life certificate every year, but I cannot simply send the completed, stamped Attestation to the Netherlands. The SVB has an arrangement with the Thai SSC, a similar organization, which checks the form again and then forwards it to Roermond, the foreign office. The SVB says that the form can be sent to the local SSC by post, but I didn't trust that completely.
The nearest office to Pattaya is in Laem Chabang and I asked a friend to hand over those forms. That was a bit too easy to think, because – I already said it – the office wants to check the form again and I had to come by myself. So I had to make the 20-kilometre ride myself, armed with forms and passport, and the form was gone through point by point with an otherwise very friendly lady. The questions that were not applicable to me were also dealt with and all ticked off with NO. Everything is in order and now I just have to trust that the papers will be sent to Roermond, so that my AOW payment (just received the payment from May, double amount because increased with holiday pay!) is not endangered.
lucky man. that you could retire well before 65, assume you are from before 1950. That is different for those born after 1949, who are excluded from everything.
enjoy it well.
I am from 1945, Frans, and took early retirement at the age of 58. I was pretty much the last one, because the scheme was getting too expensive. My early retirement was almost equal to the salary I was earning at the time.
Now after 65, the income itself has dropped somewhat, mainly due to pension breaks, but I once foreseen that and closed the gap with an annuity insurance policy.
And….. yes Frans, I enjoy it to the fullest!
Yes, who thinks when he is 14 years old and has to go to work, before his retirement, well not me.
And yes, pension breaks! well wait till i turn 65.
When I applied for my state pension, I had to send the forms to an SSO (in this case: Prachuab Khiri Khan, I picked it myself!). Obviously the receptionist didn't speak English so someone came from the back office. In short: he didn't understand what it was all about. At her request I then put the necessary crosses myself and then the (otherwise nice) lady said: okay? I said no: you must date, stamp and sign the form. Okay that lady said again, we will do that and send it to you. No, you must send it to the SVB. Okay we do.
To be sure, I emailed SVB that the application had been submitted. I received an email back saying that I should not submit the application to SSO, but only the empathy statement! SSO had to investigate whether the statement had been issued by the correct authority (in my case the immigration office (300 Baht)..SVG sent me new application forms and what was written above: submit an application to SSO in Thailand!
Then I emailed SVB again and said: indicate the correct procedure, then I can inform the other Dutch people about it! They wrote back very customer-friendly: it's all on the website (not so).
In the end everything turned out well, but really satisfied with the SVB………., no not really!
It is indeed strange that every year you have to travel from the SVB all the way to Laem Chabang, 20 kilometers from Pattaya, to hand over that paper there. Most Dutch people who live in Thailand live in Pattaya/Jomtiem and the surrounding area. But the SVB does not care about that. So no office here, where you could easily go. Just like the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, which does not have a consulate here. Many other European countries are more
"more customer friendly" for their fellow long nuts and have a consul here. We all have to go to Bangkok. First make an appointment via the website of the embassy, which is then only possible and then more than 2 hours there and back. But yes, the Netherlands would make it pleasant for us emigrants. Power belongs to the bureaucrats.
“Attestation de Vita” (life certificate)
After completing the Attestation form and the additional form for the Treaty with Thailand, you can have it checked by the Thai Immigration Office.
Then make copies for yourself and the date of sending to the SSO.
Don't trust that things will work out!
Another address I got:
Social Security Office
88/28 – Moo 4 – Tivanond Road
T. Talad-Kwan A. Muang
Nonthaburi 11000
Sincerely,
Lodewijk
If you have a yellow Tambien Baan, a Thai driver's license, you can also have the statement stamped and signed in the local Amphur.
Costs nothing….
And for some early retirement, there are various pension funds where people from after 1949 can take early retirement.
Example, Spoorwegpensioenfonds, man no longer works for NS, is indeed able to take early retirement at the age of 61 and 2 months on the basis of 25 years of pension contributions paid
And it is from September 1955
Oh yeah dude?
Yes!
Mind you, many early retirees take early retirement into account.
If you have ever paid a VUT contribution, you should check whether the VUT pot has not been deposited with a pension fund, or whether the employer pays the VUT contribution per individual person to the pension fund in the event of early retirement.
I also get these forms a few times a year.
I'm taking it to the local authority here that I got from the SVB.
An extremely friendly employee already greets us when we enter. Fill in the form together, drink a cup of coffee and go home.
Pay? zero point zero
Gerrit
Knock! here in Chiang mai also pay 0,0!
Just go to the City hall (emigration) armed with the letter from SVB and my passport, at home I have already filled in everything that is actually not allowed, but the lady who did it for me earlier had ticked everything with "yes", so ... everything came back (her fault) now I can do it myself for lack of Dutch, which is normal right? she still apologizes for what happened earlier, she puts the requested stamps + signature and that's it! and THERE/HERE on the emigration, they even have pre-printed brown envelopes WITH Roermond's address already on it! There is also a post office on site and I send my mail by registered mail, which then costs 240thb and it's done, so I'm back home in 2 hours and I also have to drive 36 km, of course there and back, email SVB that the requested item is on its way and if it is arrived, please confirm, from your side, and after 10/12 days I have the confirmation.
I understand from the responses that these are emigrated compatriots.
I am still registered in the Netherlands and live in Thailand for 11 months a year.
I usually go back in March to settle my taxes and go through the pile of mail. I also declare my medical expenses and if I still have time I visit family and friends.
Can someone explain to me the pros and cons of emigrating?
Of course I am especially curious about the financial side.
Do you know the rules?? After 8 months you must deregister from the municipality in NL, or do you stay there to continue to receive child benefit, for example? Or are you one of the 404 people who receive KB in error?
Child benefit???, I am 66.
So think before you spread such false accusations.
I'm asking a serious question, so I'd like a serious answer.
I will remain registered in the Netherlands because I do not know what the consequences are.
No, I don't know those rules.
So I can't go on holiday 11 months a year?
Dear Hans,
If you are in the Netherlands for less than 4 months, you will be deregistered
the municipal basic administration. That is why you do not have Dutch insurance
more. Do you no longer have a mortgage to pay or do you continue to pay rent for the house for that period or do you live with someone? Or do you have a postal address?
Or do you pay for the home in both the Netherlands and Thailand?
Do you work from a Ned. company in Thailand or do you live there as a pensioner, that is not a big difference.
Just a few questions that occurred to me how this is possible.
Sincerely,
Lodewijk
Thanks for your comment Louis.
I have my own house in the Netherlands and my own house in Thailand.
I don't have a mortgage.
I am an AOWer with a small pension.
I have health insurance and travel insurance.
I go to the Netherlands once a year and sometimes several times due to family circumstances. (good thing the travel insurance is there)
My question is what the financial consequences are of an emigration to Thailand.
BV: will I receive my gross/net pension?
I now pay over 200 euros a month in health costs.
I'm fine with that as well.
Greetings Hans
Dear Hans,
What are the financial consequences of staying in the Netherlands for less than 4 months?
but when staying outside Europe in this case Thailand is different per case.
For example: single or in a relationship (often with a Thai), whether or not you own a (home) in the Netherlands and a different health insurance policy with regard to worldwide coverage.
And what choice one makes in which country to pay income tax.
An application form for a
treaty declaration.
AA Insurance Hua Hin can be done via [email protected] provide information about
health insurance. (Dutch speaking people, other offices are
of course your choice)
Please note that you will also remain insured after your 70th birthday and that any previous illnesses will not
being excluded.
So far any information.
Sincerely,
Lodewijk
The Soc. Insurance bank and the Thai SSC in Phetchaburi only accept statements from the Municipality or the Dutch embassy. A statement for me from a notary office was recently refused.
A trip to the embassy takes me 2 days because of the limited opening hours. In order to be on time at the first appointment to be made, an overnight stay in a hotel is also required
I have often stated that the best proof that you are still alive is the renewal of your residence permit every year. But all pension institutions have their own rules.
Dear Gringo,
Immigration in Pattaya puts a stamp and a signature on the life certificate. Free.
Every question to SSO is answered with: you have to come by in person, but from the Netherlands it is assured that sending it is sufficient. I'll send it in and make a copy just to be sure. I email that email to Nederlnad with the message that everything has been sent to the SSO. This always went well. Goodbye,
Dick Koger
Just a small correction, Attestation de Vita is always with an E at the end. You can always go to the SSO for a statement for the benefit of your pension provider. They are willing to place a signature that you are alive. ( and no cost )
Here In Chiangmai people are very friendly, moreover one should not forget that since 2004 there is an enforcement treaty between NL and Th.
Dear Gringo
I also have several "proof of life" filling out several pensions, and have the same experience as Dick Kroger.
I fill in the forms myself, take them to the immigration in Jomtien, I live in Nongprue (just outside Pattaya).
The immigration officer puts a stamp and his signatures on it without asking anything and without even looking at it, completely free of charge.
I then send the form for the SVB to the SSO in Chonburi.
Have never had any problems with that.
Dear Hans G.
I assume you are already retired.
If you are still registered in the Netherlands, you can apply for the SVB anyway. and health insurance do not stay abroad for more than 6 consecutive months.
So with 11 months in Thailand you are in violation.
I would advise you to deregister in the Netherlands, that will give you a tax advantage in any case, because you can apply for exemption from income tax.
You will then be removed from the health insurance (medical costs),
Then make sure you first take out private health insurance in the Netherlands.
There are a few companies that also insure you if you live abroad.
Because otherwise you have to insure yourself here in Thailand, and that is less favorable.
How strange, about those 11 months.
The municipality did tell me that if I am abroad for more than 8 months, I would have to deregister. But if you keep an address here (I have my own house) and continue to meet all your obligations, you will remain a Dutch resident, so it does not have to (???)
My health insurance only covers emergency care abroad, so I have taken out continuous travel and health insurance for any minor inconveniences.
And if I return to the Netherlands, for example because I am ill, the health insurance simply takes over all obligations again.
By the way, I do NOT receive an AOW benefit, so I don't know if other rules apply.
Dear Truus,
A "continuous" travel and health insurance is generally only
Valid for 6 months in a consecutive period of residence elsewhere.
If you go on the road again after the 6th month, this period applies again.
If your insurance is different, I would like to receive that address.
Sincerely,
Lodewijk
I have the European continuous travel insurance, only valid for two months before that of Centraal Beheer permanent travel insurance. It has no term limit, and is also a few tens cheaper.
@Leo:
your comment “Then make sure you first take out private health insurance in the Netherlands. There are a few companies that also insure you if you live abroad. Because otherwise you have to insure yourself here in Thailand, and that is less favorable.”
I would like to nuance a bit.
The foreign packages offered by a number of Dutch health insurers often become outrageously expensive as you get older. It is therefore always better to first see what the options are in the field of so-called “expat” insurance, which are usually significantly cheaper.
However, taking out a package abroad with a Dutch health insurer is a safe option for people who cannot take out insurance in Thailand due to pre-existing conditions, or only with dangerous exclusions.
Keep in mind that this must be arranged while you are still registered in the Netherlands.
The Best
I am 65 years old and also have a state pension
I am registered in the Netherlands, in possession of a rented house. I pay 561 euros every month
health insurance I pay 141, euros per month
I have now been in Thailand for 8 months straight, am I also in violation?.
Is it also better for me that I write my own exhaust. I want that too, but how does that work.
The question is better, but you must formally deregister if you are outside the Netherlands for more than 182 days a year. It's very simple: you go to the town hall in your NL place of residence and unsubscribe. It can also be done in writing from Thailand. Check the website of your municipality.
The problem may be that you lose your basic health insurance. Then you have to find a health insurance somewhere in the Netherlands (Univé?) or you have to look in Thailand (AA in Hua Hin).
Thank you Mr Hans Bos.
This is great information. Get started right away.