Wine War in Thailand
Fortunately, Charly's life is full of pleasant surprises (unfortunately sometimes also less pleasant ones). Until a few years ago, he would never have dared to predict that he would spend the rest of his life in Thailand. However, he has now been living in Thailand for a while and in recent years close to Udonthani.
I can appreciate an alcoholic snack from time to time. I'm not much of a beer drinker, only when I'm very thirsty do I ever want to drink a bottle of Leo. But normally I prefer a white wine and very occasionally a whiskey or a sambucca.
That drink prices in Thailand are on the high side, to put it euphemistically, is of course known and is in itself no reason to get excited about it. But at some point it can also go too far. That's what this article is about.
Due to the high import levies and excise duties, wines, beers and other alcoholic beverages are on the pricey side compared to, for example, the Netherlands.
A few examples:
- 24 cans of Leo beer (one tray) cost about 750 baht > per can so 31,25 baht = 85 euro cents.
- A liter bottle of Red Label whiskey costs about 900 baht > is more than 24 euros
Of course you have wines in all kinds of price ranges. Let me stick to the cheaper slobber wines. In the Netherlands you can buy a 75cl bottle of white or red wine at the AH for about 2,80 euros. Probably not the cheapest, because an ALDI and LIDL will probably still have cheaper offers. In Thailand I bought white wine for about 200 baht per litre, so 75 baht = 150 euros per 4,05cl. And that was really one of the cheapest I could find. Quite expensive, if you compare it with the Netherlands.
I always bought my white wine from a wholesaler led by a Chinese. This man supplies just about every alcoholic beverage you can think of. When I came back to him two months ago, he had to disappoint me. The wine I always bought from him was no longer available. He offered me another white wine, but it had to cost 2 baht per 800 liter. Teven told him to have white wine for the next week at a price of 750 baht per 2 liters.
Based on this experience, I searched left and right for white wine, in a price range that I was used to. Well, found some leftovers at Makro and at Villa Market in UD Town. Villa Town was immediately told that the following batches of wine would be priced considerably more expensively. It was then about doubling the current price.
Also exchanged thoughts about this with the owners of daSofia and Brick House inn, two restaurants in soi sampan. They confirmed that they also have problems ordering wines at the prices that were valid until then. Some wines can no longer be ordered at all from wholesalers.
The price increases are partly caused by some excise increases by the Prajuth government. But it seems that the big wine suppliers / wholesalers have taken advantage of this tax increase to drastically increase wine prices.
The cheapest white wine I can find right now costs 750 baht per two liter pack. So 375 baht per liter! Almost a doubling, therefore, compared to about two months ago. I am talking about the Peter Vellar and Mar Sol brands. Available at Tesco Lotus and TOPS supermarket in 2 liter packs. Villa Market supplies Mar Sol in 75 cl bottles. There is also Mont Claire but, although this is sold as wine, it is not real wine. Also tried the Castle Creek, but it tastes more like water than wine. If you then try to read the label, it turns out that it contains only 10% alcohol. Hence the water taste.
In the cheap wine segment, considering price and quality, Mar Sol is the best choice, followed by Peter Vellar (both 750 baht per two liters) and African Horizon.
As far as I have been able to observe, the more expensive wines, such as Jacob Creek, have hardly increased in price and are therefore certainly eligible to be bought now. Jacob Creek is, compared to the cheap wines, definitely a class above.
Big question: where did those cheap wines from a few months ago go? Relabeled under a different name? Production stopped? Export to neighboring countries such as Laos and Cambodia? Who knows may say.
Submitted by Charlie
You cannot call the wines in packs of 2 or more liters wine
Must clair let your girlfriend read the label, it has juice in it and is not wine and in the white
Of the same name even saparot juice
I see different prices on the website.
https://shoponline.tescolotus.com/groceries/en-GB/categories/Cat00002738....
Let me preface that I don't buy a bottle of wine for 2 euro 80 at AH, for a fraction more much more quality and choice, but this aside. A reasonably good wine in the Netherlands between four and seven euros.
This is also imported from abroad in the Netherlands and then wholesalers and intermediaries and finally the liquor store and the supermarket also have to earn something from it. Partly in view of the space in the store that bottles of wine simply occupy. You can't sell anything else in that place.
Thailand is a master of slaughtering the goose with golden eggs. Wine is popular in the rest of the world, consumption increases every year, so you make it unaffordable in Thailand… Then the jug will be filled with water until it bursts and then prices will fall again in the long term. You sometimes see that with hotel prices in the low season, which are then increased to achieve the profit margin, with the opposite effect of course, Thai logic. At the moment there is a discussion going on to relax the work permits, perhaps prompted by the fact that if there had been no foreign expertise, things could have ended sadly for the boys who were rescued from the cave.
Finally, as far as wine is concerned, I hope it will become a reasonably affordable product in Thailand.
For all lovers cheers and lots of wine fun perhaps in the near future….
as a legacy from the time when it was French (and certainly after they also took over the French competitor Carrefour) SOME BigC - especially in areas where many white noses live, so certainly BKK and Pattaya and fairly extensive wine department, on my last visit was it from the 299 bt, sometimes with promotions for 250. That's french bend or sometimes australies.
NB! The VERY cheap wine is partly diluted with grape juice, which yields less Thai VAT, because of the support of fruit growers living in Thaksin regions. There are also Thai fruit wines from eg rambutan or other fruit.
This is in advance of the last substantial Thai excise increase.
Always look out for prices of products between different countries = to compare tax regimes, especially if there can be quite a bit of excise duty.
A liter of wine in Spain costs about €0,35. Then a package has to be transported around it and… the tax collector also wants to pick up a GRAIN. see e.g. https://www.jellinek.nl/vraag-antwoord/hoeveel-accijns-heft-europa-op-alcohol/ with NL: a € 0,84 / ltr, after which 21% VAT is added on the whole = retail price.
In Thailand, that was more than 400% over the price landed at the port (according to the estimate of customs, so… you get it, handful of change), so it had a very big impact on the financing. Once (1998) tried to get that off the ground, but ... eg Vila only wanted to talk about batches that had already been cleared, so the importer felt the financing costs. in other words: Vila will help you get rid of your financing headache. This also explains competitively priced parties in Thailand.
The Thai government “says that it always values the value of tourism highly for the country's economy, but they have no idea at that level of government how to nurture and promote those interests and they make no effort to to delve into what a tourist would like to find in his chosen holiday country Thailand, which he has reached after saving for a year and also having to sit in his economy seat for 12 hours.
Thai people are not wine drinkers because of the bank, but those are the tourists and then make the wine produced in their own country so expensive…….That is bullying a tourist.
The same is the case with that whole beach chair thing where these chairs are not allowed to be placed on 1 day a week and you are not allowed to bring your own bed.
The same is also the case with the unavailability of drinking a glass of alcohol on so-called Buddha days or on the king's birthday. What does a tourist have to do with that? They are not Buddhists!
A tourist really doesn't understand that when he is on holiday in Thailand for 2/3 weeks and wants to celebrate a holiday after a year of hard work.
And to think that the cheap rice 'whisky' that the Thais drink themselves is ridiculously cheap and whatever they consume in large quantities with all the traffic accidents as a result.
No, people in Thailand are now happy with the growing flow of Chinese tourists who have already paid for their all-inclusive holiday in China and do not spend any extra baht in Thailand.
They do buy their beer in the 7/11 shop and drink it in their hotel room.
That most restaurants and bars complain bitterly about the lack of Western tourists that they always had, but that eludes me The Tourist Authority of Thailand
Don't you know the Thai mentality yet? If you can't sell something, whether it's a car, house, condo, or a bottle of wine, simply raise the price! That always works!
You cannot buy an attractive wine for 3.75 bht
We made our own wine in Spain. Yes, a slop of wine, but rather better
Then what's in these packs here
At the risk of not recording it again
I make my own wine especially when the fruit is cheap. Like strawberries. Mulberry. Makiang costs nothing if you find the right tree. Now I have also made pineapple wine and rice wine. It is not difficult takes 2 to 3 months but then you also have something.
Cees Oostzaan asks
john will or can give you with the recipe also have a lot of fruit trees can't eat it
thank you in advance
Hi John,
I've been toying with the idea of making my own wine for a while now, if only for fun. I live in Isaan, maybe I can grow grapes there. But how do I make wine? Can I find that somewhere?
Hi Charly, to start with, most wines contain between 11 and 13% wine alcohol, so 10% is indeed a bit too low, you are right.
I can't say anything about it being more expensive, just repeating what my housekeeper always said… Better too expensive than not for sale.
Greetings. Harmen.
With the (almost) disappearance of the better party boxes of wine, except for a few unknown brands, we have to rely on the bottles.
Back then, we usually bought the Chilean wine Mar y Sol.
After a short interruption, it is available again BUT :
– The statement Chilian Wine is missing on the front of the bottle
– at the back of the bottle the mention Chili is missing and it now says Siam Winery
– the tax stamp has a yellow/brown colour
– the mention “fruit wine” means that it has been diluted with grapejuice (up to 90%!)
All this to avoid the higher taxation, at the expense of taste. Not to mention fooling the wine lover. A bad side of LOS.
There are now many "fruit wines" and it is clearly stated. The price is around 500 baht per bottle and the tax stamp is yellow / brown. ! Indeed, Jacob's Creek, among others, is now a better and fairer choice!
EXCISE DUTY FOR SPIRITS IN THAILAND
• Imported whiskey = green sticker – excise duty: 100%
• Imported cognac = brown sticker – excise duty: 100%
• Imported vodka, gin, tequila, cocktail mixer (others) = orange sticker – excise duty: 100%
• Local whiskey = dark blue sticker – excise duty: na
• Imported wines = blue sticker – excise duty: 300-400%
• Wines bottled in Thailand (“input locally”) = yellow/brown sticker – excise duty: 100%
• Local wines = yellow sticker – excise duty: 100%
• Imported sherry = blue sticker – excise duty: na
• Cider = orange sticker – excise duty: na
. Chinese imported spirits carry many different colours.
Note:
https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/998862-what-is-it-with-all-the-fruit-wine-concealed-as-red-wine/
http://www.thebigchilli.com/news/fruit-wine-is-it-for-real
Real, imported wine is taxed with 400% import tax. The boxes are diluted with all kinds of fruit, is actually no longer wine, is no longer mentioned on the boxes or on the
Bottles.
And Peter Vella is a sweet mixture, sold as wine, the Thai love it, because it's full of sugar, and then drink it with lots of ice..yuck.
For example, if you want to drink real wine, you have to pay for it, or drive to Nong Kai and buy a stock of real wine in the tax-free shop on the border with Laos.
Dear Litter,
That seems like a very useful suggestion. I live about 50 kilometers from Nong Khai.
So driving to Nong Khai (back and forth, in one day) doesn't seem like a problem to me.
Do you have any idea what wines are offered in that tax-free shop and at what price?
And to get to that tax-free shop, do you have to leave Thailand or is that tax-free shop just on this side of the border?
Regards,
Charly
Note: You can also email me at [email protected]
Thanks for the many responses. I took a good look at the packaging, but nowhere does the name “wine” appear.
Briefly listed:
Peter Vella > House White, 11,5%. No indications about the composition of the contents, only the mention of 2 litres
Mont Clair > White Celebration Fruity, 12%. No indications about the composition of the contents, only the mention of 2 litres.
Mar Y Sol > Private Selection SB White, 12%. No indications about the composition of the contents, only the mention of 2 litres.
I have the above mentioned "wines" in stock at home, so I could read the labels / packaging.
Unfortunately no Jacob Creek in the house, otherwise I would have looked at it too.
But the conclusion that Peter Vella, Mont Clair and Mar Y Sol are not wines can be drawn in my opinion.
Regards, Charlie
Most residents in Thailand pay no tax at all.
The poor earn too little to pay taxes, which is a lot to ask.
The elite also do not pay taxes , have so many deductions and exemptions that they do not have to pay .
The money has to come from somewhere to keep the BV Thailand running, so we are increasing the tax on imported goods, which unfortunately also includes red and white wines and Harley Davidson as much as 60%.
Jan Beute.
All citizens of Thailand pay taxes. The revenue of the state comes mainly from sales and business taxes, in addition to excise duties, which are paid by everyone.
Only 6% of Thais pay income tax, which is responsible for 18% of the state's revenue.
That means the poorest pay nearly as much tax as the middle class, percentage-wise. Only the top 6% earners pay more.
Jan Beute and Tino Kuis, you are both right. Tariffs are an instrument to favor groups and to burden other groups. A higher turnover tax places a heavier burden on low incomes, but the government takes it upon itself because then those incomes digest less: after all, they simply earn a lot less.
A worker in Thailand has deductions, exemptions and a zero bracket and, up to the age of 65, will easily not have to pay about -roughly- the first 300.000 THB. If you are 64+, you will quickly receive the 5 income that you do not pay.
Excise duty is mainly on alcohol and smoking tobacco; don't think that the poorest get to do that: tobacco grows here on the land, and fire water is heated by oneself.
There are excise duties on many other products, including vehicles, petrol, diesel, soft drinks, etc.
But THE tax that everyone pays is VAT, although the richer 6% that Tino writes about can partly reclaim that by buying in their own company name. The wealthier 6% also benefit from the current government's special “consumer or tourism” promotions, where you can deduct 15,000 baht each time. This is of course only possible if you are within the exemption limit and therefore already enjoy an above-normal income.
A blue-collar worker does not pay any income tax, but also has no VAT exemption.
Clear explanation, I learned something again. Because the excise duties on imported wine are so absurdly high in my view, the price of a bottle of good quality wine does not differ much from a bottle of whisky. Perhaps the reason that in restaurants there is often a bottle of whiskey on the table instead of wine. Local wine, for example the wine from Silverlake near Pattaya, is often just as expensive despite the much lower excise tax, while I sometimes find the taste downright disappointing. In Thailand I enjoy drinking the various white wines from the aforementioned Jason Creek. With some regularity offers in e.g. Friendship on South Pattaya Road or at the supermarket at the bus station of the airport bus near Thepprasit Road. Incidentally, the price of a bottle of wine in a restaurant in Thailand does not differ much compared to the Netherlands. In Thailand, the purchase price is increased by a fixed amount, sometimes only a few hundred Baht, while in the Netherlands the purchase price rises on average 5 to 6 times! But drinking your bottle of wine in your Thai condo or apartment is quite expensive.
Now that I've read all this, I'm going to Cambodia in October after a week in Bangkok. Everything is much cheaper.
bottled wine is good for cooking, not for drinking.
Harmen kitchen chef/
Dear Charlie,
A few years ago I did some research and came to the following conclusions:
There are 2 types of wine in Thailand
Wine made from 100% grapes. AND
Wine diluted with at least 10% fruit wine
You hardly have to pay excise duty for the latter.
For the former, the excise duty was increased substantially last year (I think July 1).
A bottle of real wine is more expensive than a bottle of whiskey.
This is particularly reflected in the "cheaper" wines. It is less noticeable with the more expensive wines (50 euros plus).
It is also important that you do not have to pay import duties on Australia (mutual country agreement).
This makes Australian wines relatively cheaper.
What surprises me is that in a study of wine imports in Thailand in 2014, I found that France would import the most wine in percentage terms and Australians were in third place at the time.
It is clear to me that the authors of the excise rates in Thailand regard wine as haughty and that must be paid for.
Solution: order a container (40.000 liters) of wine in Australia (approx. 45.000 euros all in) with excise duty of approx. 120.000 euros, you end up with 3 euros per litre, or pay a little more per bottle.
The high excise duty on wine is the result of the market monopoly of the local Sino-Thai families who produce beer, whiskey and rum. These families see wine as a possible competition and want to avoid that. With this high excise duty, wine remains a niche product.
Incidentally, family members often have their own vineyard in Thailand. Eg PB Valley in Khao Yai. PB stands for Piya Bhirombhakdi, of the Boonrawd brewery family.
I also know very wealthy Thais who every year in France, Italy or Australia buy a whole harvest from a wine producer for private use. In that case, they simply avoid the excise tax, because there is no trade in Thailand.
I miss the information about the many excellent and multiple primed wines from different Thai winemakers such as Monsoon from Hua Hin. If you want to drink champagne you pay more if you buy sparkling wine. It is exactly the same with that. If you are looking for an excellent Shiraz or Merlot wine, buy that wine made in many Thai wineries. Then you are rid of the "import" hassle.
Besides the fact that the local wines are of mediocre quality, imports are not the problem. Excise duty is also on local wine.
Hello people from Pattaya and surroundings. I buy my wines from a wholesaler at purchase price + VAT. If you are interested in buying, and then per 12 bottles, you can contact me. I buy from Vanich. My address: [email protected]
The price of wine has indeed risen sharply. My girlfriend has a small coffee shop (bar – restaurant) and so far we tried to keep the price low for beer and wine, but it is becoming untenable to be profitable with those heavy price increases. The Western tourist who stays a little longer in Thailand still wants relatively cheap prices and we certainly don't need it from the Chinese.
Unfortunately, as a notoriously budget expat, there is only one thing left for me: Lao khao. The rest is unaffordable in this country compared to the Netherlands.
Ask your employer for a drink allowance. 🙂 If there really is no beer or wine, I feel sorry for you. Then as an expat (= temporary migrant, often posted abroad) you can either move back to your own country earlier than planned or take it easy when you are on holiday in Europe. Are you an emigrant, start a distillery or brewery at home.
Was meant to be funny. I still live in the Netherlands. I agree wholeheartedly with your definition of the often incorrectly used “expat” (sounds better than longstayer or long-term overage tourist). A distillery? Good idea! Lao Tom? That stuff from an old oil drum?
Please contact Vanessa from Vinum Lector. They sell a nice bottle of Australian Shiraz Bandicoot red and white, for THB 295.- incl. 7% VAT. In addition, they also have a wide range of good and affordable wines.
They are located in Bangkok, but will soon also open a branch in Hua Hin.
[email protected]