The majority of Dutch expats eventually want to return
More than two-thirds of Dutch expats abroad eventually want to return home, according to research by the Intelligence Group.
The results of the survey among 35.000 expats from different countries appear in the weekly magazine Intermediair.
Expats from the Netherlands mainly go abroad to gain experience and to get acquainted with other cultures. They often leave with the thought of returning later. A big difference with, for example, Belgians and French. They are abroad because of the economic crisis with no intention of returning. It is not clear why the Dutch think differently about this than the Belgians and the French.
The countries most often left for a return to their home country are Australia (84 percent), Brazil (74 percent), the Netherlands (62 percent) and China (61 percent).
Around 90 percent of Israelis, Belgians and Greeks do not want to return to their country of birth. For Belarus, 95 percent of expats do not want to return, which can be explained by the political circumstances in that country.
The Dutch often return because of the social culture in the Netherlands.
The fact that the expat leaves “with the thought of returning later” should be (almost) 100%, otherwise you are not an expat but an emigrant. After all, an expat leaves with the idea of settling elsewhere temporarily (work, study, etc.). An emigrant leaves with the idea that this is permanent. Now people can come back to this later and make a different choice, so that the expat does not return and the emigrant still decides to pack the suitcases.
So what have they tested now? Still about people who left as expats and later changed their mind or…?
To get a good picture, you would ask people who move abroad whether this is for a permanent or temporary purpose. And then ask that question again after a few years and again many years later. It is a pity that Statistics Netherlands does not keep a detailed record of who is leaving, while we still have the necessary figures for arrivals (country of birth, nationality(s), origin group, country from which they flew in, etc.).
I don't believe in that story, At the social security office in Thailand, where Dutch
expats have to report for proof of life to the SVB, the payer of the state pension, I was told that in Chonburi, the province that they check about
300 Dutch people 65 + who live in Thailand.
In the past 4 years that they performed their supervisory task for the SVB, they
only experienced 2 times that someone returned to the Netherlands.
Usually for health problems. Because of course it concerns the elderly
the girls of the office often have to say goodbye to some Dutch ones
expats. As strange as it may sound, they have those males and their Thai female
Don't forget who came to report themselves every year.
When I go there again with my wife, I often get a report of that
expat who is very happy and after a good life is gone.
WHO IS GOING BACK TO THE NETHERLANDS?
Not even in a box yet.
J. Jordan
@ Cor, an expat is someone who works abroad (short stay). Not to be confused with emigrants or pensionados (long stay).
I think this is an apt description of expats in Thailand
http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expatriates_in_Thailand
A nice description, but if you, as a retiree, plan to die in Thailand and therefore assume a “one-way trip” (relocation) when you leave the Netherlands, then you are a migrant (immigrant from Thailand and emigrant from the Netherlands). If you go to Thailand after your retirement to live there temporarily, for a longer or shorter period of time, you are an expat. The difference between these is not discussed in this article, perhaps because “expat” is more comfortable than saying that you are a migrant? The question is also how realistic it is for a retiree (65-67 and older) to temporarily stay in Thailand for a longer period of time (15-20 years). Don't think anyone in their late 80s or early 90s will return to the Netherlands anytime soon?
Also from wikipedia
“Expatriates and immigrants
The dividing line between an expatriate and an immigrant is blurred. Immigrants go somewhere to settle permanently, while the expatriate sees himself as a temporary resident of a foreign country and is perceived as such. However, it is possible that an expat decides to settle permanently in the other country, or that a migrant decides to return.
Often one can distinguish between the initial motive and the mentality and behavior. Immigrants leave with the motive of permanently settling abroad, while an expat's departure is intended to be temporary.”
Agree and physically you can call yourself an immigrant but officially you are only an immigrant if you have that status administratively and that is what most people lack in Thailand since they reside here under a non-immigrant status.
It is of course very good when you speak (or write) about something to first establish the necessary definitions.
Expats (or on wikipedia as expariates) are people who have “made their home” (or simply live) in a country other than that of their nationality. This can be for a shorter period of time (usually posted for their work) or for a longer period of time (whether or not they are retired).
Now someone can move from country and, in particular, also return to the country of his nationality. To then (still) say: that was not an expat, or to say (still) that was not an expat, but an emigrant is very clumsy when you don't go back.
I would like to suggest that he who lives in a country while he (or she) does not have the nationality of that country, but does have the nationality of another country, is an expat. You are an emigrant as soon as you acquire nationality in your 'new' country. If you want to be a legal expat living there (indefinitely) in Thailand, then you do not have a Thai passport, but you do have another passport, with a “Non-emigrant” visa stamped in that other (for example, Dutch) passport, or whatever any extendable visa other than a tourist visa.
khun,
You are right, but regarding the Thai situation where everyone who lives here only gets a "temporary stay" and has to renew their visa every year, you cannot
speak of a real emigration. Maybe a bit far fetched, but still.
JJ
In Thailand you are allowed to stay (most of them) every year renewal and report every 90 days. I'm 68 and don't think about returning to Belgium. I can't find anything. Only the pension counts for me. I have worked far too long and for the years that I have worked too much I do not receive a pension, but I have always been able to pay.
I don't pay taxes in Thailand. Life is cheap here. The sun shines most of the time and I don't have to heat here for six months. In Belgium you get robbed by the state. Last year theft of 6% of savings (from 15 to 21%) and now there is again a shortage of money and VAT will probably rise. There are legal thieves in Brussels.
Why return to that country?
Many Belgians and Dutch people have a Thai wife or girlfriend. These also play a role. Do they stay in Europe or do they wish to return to their homeland? I think this also plays a role in whether you want to stay in Thailand or return and stay.
I come teryg to my first point, Can one stay, If anything ever goes wrong with immigratian, an officer's decision can change the whole future.
Daniel
An expatriate (in abbreviated form, expat) is a person temporarily or permanently residing in a country and culture other than that of the person's upbringing. The word comes from the Latin terms ex (“out of”) and patria (“country, fatherland”).
expatriate
the emigrant n (m.) Pronunciation: [emiˈxrɑnt] Inflections: -en (plural) the emigrant noun. (v.) Pronunciation: [emiˈxrɑntə] Inflections: -n, -s (plural) someone who leaves his own country to live in another country
Found on http://www.woorden.org/woord/emigrant
expat
the expat n. (m./f.) Pronunciation: ['ɛkspɛt] Inflections: expat|s (plural) someone who lives abroad for a long time as an employee of a multinational Example: `Expat is a shortening of the English word expatriate.` …
Found on http://www.woorden.org/woord/expat
This then demonstrates that there is indeed a difference between the English-speaking understanding of expat and the Dutch-speaking one.
The word expat common in Thailand is the English version I'm afraid.
So temporarily or permanently residing……….
Well, I am equipped with a Dutch passport (and no other passport). Still, I don't want to go back to the Netherlands, unless - and then only for a fortnight or so - I would do a good Thai friend of mine a favor by showing him around there. He has sometimes talked about it, but maybe wrongly (?) informed by me, he doesn't need it (anymore). Incidentally, it may be easy for me to talk, because I no longer have family in the Netherlands. But there is a lot more and different so I don't need to go there.
To be honest, I don't feel like spouting my bile here in detail, and certainly not tarring all Dutch people with the same brush, because I like to keep it positive. That's how I am naturally inclined, but that is precisely why I do not want to be tested until the day I die by the (not just meteorological) bad climate in the Netherlands. For me, joy lies in erudition, civilization, being left undisturbed as much as I need it, exchanging ideas (now often by e-mail), etc., just being a thinking person, free from objections. hostile treatment meted out to me. I cannot be free with busybodies, know-it-alls and go-getters around me, and with people who make trouble and fuss over nothing of importance or value, well, as is common in the Netherlands. In the Netherlands you have to look for the civilization and friendly contact that has become rare there, here in Thailand you just encounter approachable people on the street. So I'm returning to the Netherlands for a longer period - certainly not at all - or for a short period of time? So no, perhaps with the exception mentioned. Those who are (still) there and want to meet me in person, come here. And indeed some of them do.
What matters is whether an expat often eventually returns to his country of nationality (also referred to as his country of origin), or whether he continues to live in Thailand in particular.
What I have noticed time and again, somewhat to my surprise, is that people who have moved into accommodation in Thailand often travel up and down at least once a year, especially to the Netherlands, or any country of origin, but it seems that mainly Dutch people are notorious up-and-down travelers. It often comes down to the fact that they exchange the water-cold wintry Netherlands for the sunny Thai high season. Some even prefer the usually vicious April weather in the Netherlands to the somewhat (too) warm April weather in Thailand, although it is still wonderful to swim on the coast of Thailand in a sea full of bath water at the right temperature; If you don't live on the coast in Thailand, go on holiday with the Thai in a seaside resort in April -their holiday month-; at least that is recommended if you are not xenophobic, so you have easy contact with people like the Thai, who are not.
Conversations that are so easy to have with Thai people, for example on the beach - which I sometimes experience in the Netherlands - often go something like this: “Where you come from?”. Next question is how long have I been here. And then: when I go back again (just up and down or permanently). Well, at least in principle neither. Why? “Where do I see such smiling faces like yours? Not there, but here!” Which is of course a laughing matter. I once drew an 'emoticon' in the sand. One with the corners of the mouth down ("that's a falang"), one with the corners up ("that's you").
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But of course, you can argue as much as you want, someone who is psychomatically tied to where he comes from, you can talk his ears off, but not his feelings from the heart. Most Dutch people do not want to leave the Netherlands at all, and therefore do not. And then there are the doubters: those who are half an expat and half a native Dutch at the same time.
People are often tied to their feelings of displeasure. Mothers and daughters who live in a love-hate relationship with each other. The husband/son-in-law can get an excellent job elsewhere, but the wife/daughter-of-mother in question does not want to leave because of her attachment to her feelings of displeasure with her mother. There are strong examples of that.
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And, yes, you could wait for it. An investigation will now take place. Questionnaires are devised and the collected answers are processed statistically. It is in fact an investigation into the psyche of the expat (who may or may not - often - be looking for an exotic woman; the former is back to mother).
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Psychologists try to be scientists. A good endeavor. But whether the research in question also produces a lot of science is a fearful question. In any case, not just one small piece of research can yield a lot of science. If it is established as a provisional outcome that many expats will return permanently after all, this could persuade doubters (to go back after all) or if it turns out that permanent return is rare, this could also help doubters to decide (but then just to stay in Thailand anyway). Because yes, people do not usually decide for themselves, but tend to choose the largest group to which they then join.
I think that it is not always possible to return to the Netherlands. when I look at the history of, for example, the “Indonesian” Dutch people, you often come across problems that arise with age. because language becomes a problem. they often speak little or bad Dutch, so if you end up in a nursing home or retirement home, that is a problem. people become totally alienated from their environment because they cannot make themselves understood or understand nothing. it seems to me that you become very lonely in such a situation.
The fact that it is not an unknown problem is evident from the fact that there are special care homes in the Netherlands for the “Indonesian” elderly.
even if you continue to live with your partner in such a case it seems very difficult because of the language.