Good or bad? Say it!
Living in Thailand I sometimes think what a boring life I have actually had. In love, engaged, married, unfortunately no children, always worked, got promotions, unfortunately became a widower too early, took early retirement and now I am retired and lead a quiet life in the bustling city of Pattaya.
I now have a beautiful Thai wife and a son who is almost 21 years old. We are well off, we have a nice house, good family contacts and I, married like a dog, don't interfere with other women. Of course I like to look at other women, undress them with my eyes and then dream of finding them under my bed sheet someday. Isn't that already unfaithful?
Relationship stories
How different could it have been? I think I know Thai life quite well and what stands out are the countless stories about relationships between a foreigner and a Thai lady. Just like with me, there are a lot of relationships, I think the majority, that go well without a single problem. But – to put it mildly – things don't always go well. In the beginning I sometimes thought it was sad, sometimes unbelievable, but in the long run you become hardened in those stories. I've long since reached a point where I can only laugh at the umpteenth variation of a failed contact.
Shane and Mae
Take the story I read on an English forum. A once-married American – let's call him Shane – comes to Thailand and meets his new future wife (say Mae) of his dreams. No, not from the bar circuit, she works in the service of a Svensen ice cream parlor. No, there is not a big age difference either, he is 35 and she is 31 years old.
He works “off shore” on a supply ship and comes to Thailand every four weeks to see his beloved. The relationship is going well, they do fun things together, he supports her and the family with some money and slowly but surely a marriage is in sight. Mae has a large circle of friends and some of her friends do have a relationship with a foreigner. Shane meets those friends and foreigners and it is always a pleasure to have a BBQ or do other fun things in groups.
Other "friend"
What Shane notices is that over time some of the friends suddenly show up with another foreign friend. While he was convinced that the relationship with the foreigner, whom he had met before, seemed quite solid. “That is true,” Mae tells him when asked: “But her steady boyfriend is not in Thailand at the moment because of his work, so my girlfriend occasionally goes out with another man. Very normal"
Shane thinks it's strange because it doesn't happen with one girlfriend, but several times he has to meet yet another foreign guy. He does not go into further detail, after all, the relationship with his Mae is going well and after about three years it is decided to marry each other. All preparations are made in her village and Shane returns to Thailand after four weeks of work to get married.
Disappointment
He even arrives two days earlier than planned to surprise his Mae, but does not find her in the rented condo. When asked, he then finds out, how doesn't matter how, but you guessed it, that she spent the previous nights with another foreigner in a hotel. She loves Shane dearly, but if he's not in Thailand, she doesn't have to live like a nun, does she? Well then! After all, sex is something physical and does not necessarily have anything to do with love.
The marriage is off. Shane finds some disgraceful, unacceptable behavior and breaks off the relationship. Good or bad?
Africa
Now before you and I judge that, we would of course like to know how that Shane behaves during those four weeks outside Thailand. Does he only live for his work or does he occasionally have a break in the harbor?
Unfortunately we do not know about Shane, in my circle of acquaintances (pool hall, remember?) there is someone who also works “in the oil” in an African country. Neatly married to a Thai lady, one child together and the second on the way. I know him quite well and he has often hinted that there is always a beautiful negro girl (oh, I can't say that, a local lady) waiting for him in his African flat and pampering him during those four weeks there. Good or bad?
I recently had a conversation about this subject with a couple of friends, yes, also a Thai lady and a foreigner. When I told them the above, the lady didn't look surprised at all. Indeed, she didn't think it was more than normal either. “You know,” she said, “if my boyfriend wants to sleep with another woman now and then, he should. I don't have any problem with it. Our hearts are melted, no one can intervene and that's what it's all about”. When I asked her if she sometimes did the same, I was surprised to receive an affirmative answer. “Yes, I do it occasionally. I pick up a nice looking foreigner for a one night stand and say goodbye to him in the morning. I often don't even know his name, because he must be and remain a completely unknown man to me”. Good or bad?
I like it all, it's fine with me. I can see the comic in this present behavior and honestly sometimes I think, I was just a young guy (with the science of today of course!).
– reposted message –
With the ladies from the bar circuit, especially if they are still at a young age, you can assume for 99% that they are cheating. Seen it so many times and it's always the same story. No offense to Gringo, but a girl who comes to Pattaya to work at the Svenssen ice cream parlor almost certainly has some activities besides, after working hours at places like walking street. So I put them under the same category. She could not afford to rent a room, have a telephone, and also money for food and necessary things such as clothing, make-up, etc. and then also go out once in a while at places like Walking Street on a salary from the Svenssen alone. . In addition, such a girl can work for the Svenssen throughout the country and does not have to go to Pattaya.
Often they exchange phone numbers with their one night stands and even when they are in a relationship they still maintain some contacts as Backup. If hubby is away from home for a few weeks, there will still be some extra income from the old regular clientele. Goes through a second Facebook account, or even a second phone with a separate Line account, etc.
That doesn't mean that those girls don't have serious relationship plans. But people just think differently about sex here than in the west. Sex is something you do mainly for pleasure and not necessarily out of love. Throw in some extra baht and everyone is happy.
That is not only with foreigners, but many of those girls also have a lover in their home village, or even just have a Thai boyfriend in pattaya.
And if you think it starts in places like Pattaya, no. For example, many girls who go to university do not receive much money from their parents. So they either start a relationship with a boyfriend who has more financial resources (it is quite normal in Thailand for sons to receive more allowances than daughters) or they earn some extra money in karaoke bars or massage parlours. Or have a number of permanent contacts that they occasionally visit for some extra income.
A girl of about 25 years old sent me a message on Facebook. I knew her from a while ago but she had disappeared from the face of the earth for a while, until I suddenly got a message. Was with her parents in Khon Kaen for a while and after some small talk she says it would be nice to see you again after all this time, I say fine no plans today so come along. Once home drink and conversation, she had been in a relationship but had been single for a while, she insisted. One thing leads to another, we move to the bedroom and at the exact moment of suprême her phone starts ringing, her Italian boyfriend on the Line video chat wants to know where she is. I've known her longer than today, and I didn't believe she was single, just have to laugh about it afterwards 🙂
Moral of the story is, if you're looking for fidelity, try it with a woman who you know can just take care of herself, preferably a bit older. 35 years or so, when they are tired of the party lifestyle and just want to get on with their lives. Those young girls are nice, but if you look the other way for 2 minutes, they are lying between the sheets with someone else. If you are still looking young, look for a lady with a good job or from a good family. But they often have less interest in farang.
Incidentally, I have also often heard women who simply openly say to their husbands, 1 or 2 times sex a week is enough, if you want more often, you can do it with someone else. Especially if the loot is already in, and they are married.
About Mae's reaction in the story, that Shane would be unreasonable. That is precisely the cultural difference. In the western country, a marriage ends almost immediately if the husband or wife does it outside the door. If a Thai woman catches her husband cheating (or vice versa, man catches wife) then it often remains with a strong exchange of words and then the matter is over. More often than not, the woman gets into trouble with the lady her husband cheated with, instead of blaming her husband. Unlike the west where we are used to the partner being blamed.
Especially in relationships with young ladies you have to be able to have something, and if you don't like the don't know what doesn't hurt mentality then it's better to just stay single or stick to short relationships.
Best is simply if you live in Thailand full time and live with your girlfriend or wife. Then relationships also have the best chance of success. If you are regularly abroad, you are never completely sure.
Incidentally, the falang who work in such offshore positions are certainly not all that good either. In a job like Shane's, working on a supply boat or drilling platform, it's not too bad because they don't have much time and are usually at sea. But then you always have the crew change day and that usually involves a hotel stay. Almost every hotel in Asia, Africa or South America either has a brothel on site or activities like that are very close by. It almost always concerns men with a lot of money in their pocket and in that business there is also a high percentage of singles, so one thing attracts the other, which is simple enough.
But even in the west you are not always sure of yourself in those kinds of professions. When I was still a student at the nautical college you had an after hours club nearby. Young wives of seafarers away from home were known to regularly pick up a man or student for a night of fun when they got a little itchy. I also know women with nautical and offshore positions and a large part of them didn't take it that seriously either, 2-3 weeks at sea and then the male colleagues also became more and more interesting.
Live and let live 🙂
I am not at all surprised by this story of Gringo. As a single I have regularly picked up a Thai who later turned out to have a boyfriend or husband.
Well, a flirt in the Seven Eleven or in the Big C, pass it if you have no obligations.
It must be a bit ingrained, I think, because I don't think this is a coincidence anymore.
As far as I'm concerned, it belongs to Thailand, although I don't think everyone is so happy with it.
sex is always acceptable if both parties agree. It is a Christian narrow-mindedness that has a hard time with it. As a reminder, marriage was only introduced at the end of the Middle Ages to curb the debauchery of the working people. They had to save their strength for work. The ruling and thus wealthy class did not have to adhere to this, nor did they have much else to do. This rule is well known, look at the excesses of Prince Bernard, the Kennedys, Clinton, the Hiltons, you name it. All Christian people with a marriage promise, which they flouted. We all know polygamy, polygamy also exists. To everyone's delight. People can only cheat if both partners do it.
In my opinion, a permanent relationship is based on trust and mutual respect. If you know about your partner that you hurt them if you have to cheat, then this should be enough reason not to.
You enter into a permanent relationship when you are ready and then it is a matter of course that you give each other love, attention and everything that comes with it. That includes the sex story and if the relationship is really loving, then that's enough. Are other women or men no longer important in this area.
So know yourself and know what you are doing. Don't get into a steady relationship if one partner isn't enough, unless of course that man or woman is also set up that way. But then what remains of that steady relationship, not much in my opinion.
There are too many people who can't stand temptations like sex, drugs and rock and roll and money.
This has a great influence on the existence of a lot of people. Often they spoil relationships which can lead to cases of crime of passion.
A while ago in walking street by that Thai man who stabbed his girlfriend when he noticed that his girlfriend was having sex with a foreigner. Terrible that this happens, but it can come to this with some people who use excessive force, you also have those people.
So be sensible and remain a free person if you are not suitable for a steady relationship and don't get involved with married or steady relationship people because it can just end up wrong and that is of no use to anyone.
So where do all these stories come from about jealousy, penises cut off and fed to the dog, murder and manslaughter? It is written above: live and let live, but that really does not happen in my experience. Two serious relationships taught me that Thai ladies are as jealous as the shots.
That is also Thailand in its entirety.
If you do it the house is too small, Facebook IG and all the social media they can find are full of drama. Conversely, if they lie between the sheets with someone else the next day, it didn't mean anything 🙂
Jealousy mainly plays out in the financial field. They don't always mind you doing it outside the door, so to speak, but they're more apprehensive about you running off with a younger model. And so their wallet runs out.
I once went out with a girl, also a lot of Facebook accounts and 100 falang numbers in her phone. Not my type so it stayed with that time. The next times I ran into her she got mad because I was with another lady. And that while she herself was in the company of another falang. Has nothing to do with my personality, is purely status related. She knew I also work in the offshore industry and her boyfriend for that night was an English teacher at a local school. Conversely, if someone had passed by in a Ferrari, I would undoubtedly have been forgotten.
Thai ladies really don't hold back when they know you're taken or even married. If they think they can find a better deal or that they can squeeze themselves into your relationship, they certainly won't. Wives and girlfriends are very aware of this and a large part of that behavior stems from that.
Also has to do with how many Thai ladies view marriage. A Thai lady is almost only interested in getting married up. That means marrying a man who comes from a better background than herself. Equivalent is only possible if a Thai woman has something with a man from a poorer family or lower social status, then it may remain a romance, but there is often no marriage.
Dear Theo Hua Hin, Whether the stories about penises being cut off are all true I doubt, while I can endorse the fact that they are often very jealous.
A Thai lady who loses her boyfriend or husband often loses not only a boyfriend, but also her financial and social security.
Something a Western lady in most European countries often fears less, because especially when she is married, she is protected by many rules and laws.
It is quite normal that this happens. Thai ladies hate being alone.
A night out with friends costs money and then go out with a farang
you can still buy nice shoes the next day. The choice was made quickly.
One piece of advice I want to give. If you think you've found true love, hire a detective
to check her background and doings.
In our culture that is not done so much, but in Thailand with the higher social class this is the
normal procedure.
A relationship is an investment and I'd rather have that checked than let me be cheated.
Thai ladies, in their twenties, who are in a relationship with a farang, often well into their 60s or above, have sexual desires that cannot always (or often ?) be fulfilled by their partner. Know of a number that they hire a Thai 'toyboy' for a fee, by whom they are satisfied. Sometimes the farang knows about this, but often not. But all those married guys who seek their sexual satisfaction from someone other than their partner and are willing to pay a lot of money for it, will generally not flaunt it either.
Gentlemen and ladies come on now,
Have been to Pattaya so many times and farangs still fall for it. I as a single have fun with the ladies and have a good time with them. But nothing else!! you already know in advance that it is pointless to transfer money to them. Then they say thank you and have the next farang again. I can't believe I still read and hear stories about farangs buying whole houses and then getting dumped. Keep your head up!! If you really want to get to know a thai woman then pattaya is not the right place for it. And even if they don't like it when they see you with another woman, well bad luck for them. They do exactly the same! I spoke to an Englishman who has been living in Thailand pattaya for 25 years and was in real estate with his Thai wife. Then you know each other through and through and you really choose each other. So have a good time with the ladies, have fun but just don't start a relationship in Pattaya!
And yet I know a lot of farangs who started a relationship with a barmaid and who are now good couples 15 years later. Of course you have to be reasonable. When you're 70, you shouldn't start a relationship with a 22-year-old girl.
I know many Thai bar girls who now live in Belgium, have a job and children; All of them normal and good relationships.
I doubt you know many falangs who are concerned about this. You do know a number, as you indicate, where it would go well. I take that from you. There are indeed those successes, but I still think that this is not the case for the most part. I have very different experiences and have known the Thai scene for over 20 years. In the Netherlands I got to know many through my Thai wife and almost all of them have problem relationships. Because we wanted to stay far away from here, contacts had become very scarce after many years, but rest also does something. All those parties with hassle, stop it. Glad I'm off that. A bar lady is used to having sex quickly and they don't turn their hands around for it. Within a relationship that offers something to hold on to, and certainly with children, this is less of an issue, but it often comes up again. The blood creeps where it can't go. Especially if they benefit from it, then hopping over is an order of the day.
A friend of mine in the Netherlands had also invested in his current relationship. Found his Thai bar lady in Thailand, the land where dreams come true. Cost him a lot of money, integration, residence permit, board and lodging two children for free. Well after 2 years the monkey came out of the sleeve. The lady wanted to start a massage parlor in the Netherlands, because she was good at that. So this cost him money again. The lady worked from 10 o'clock in the morning until 10 o'clock in the evening and he took care of the children and also his own job. Turned out that the lady was doing odd jobs with happy ending massage. Yes, another sad story. He is now in a divorce with all the conditions that entails. Life can be beautiful, but it is often an illusion. Be aware of what you are getting and if it is too good to be true, this is often not a good advisor.
I once came across a lady on the dance floor in a nightclub in Pattaya, wildly provocative and scantily dressed, dancing towards the erotic, clearly letting the flowers go.
Nothing wrong with that, were it not for the fact that she was married to a compatriot, as she reported without batting an eyelid, who had gone to the Netherlands for a few months, which he did every year to visit family and to do some business. He well over 60 and she around 30 years.
Every evening she could be found there and often saw her leave slightly intoxicated with young farang men who apparently had no problem with her having an old husband, assuming she told them that too.
Afterwards he sometimes encountered the couple in BigC, she perky next to him, he proudly behind the pram with his wife and child ...
And then the question: is the child mine or another Farang's?
At least he's proud of it!
You can't generalize, but many ladies who make their money in the nightlife are part of a fantasy world. Many men who come into contact with such a woman have the feeling that they have finally drawn the lottery ticket. Often they have found a female, who has mastered the act better than any other. Even if you point it out to these farangs, they don't want it true. There are enough females who have their boyfriends everywhere, so that they receive monthly support from all over the world. They keep accounts exactly when the paying boyfriend comes back to Thailand, so they don't get into trouble with double appointments. For the connoisseurs and colleagues from this world, this is an open secret. It is therefore also amazing that they find a new sacrifice every time, which they often cover with their so-called, PLOBLEMS”. With several boyfriends, they have no problem reporting mother as sick or even dead several times a year, as long as it benefits them financially. They keep laughing sweetly, and when it yields a thousand baths more, they start to cry on command.
In Pattaya in particular, it is indeed not that difficult to date a waitress, for example, who works in a Starbucks, Pizza Hut and the like. Experienced 'me wait you when me stop work in shop' several times.
Massage ladies are often up for it and I mean ladies from the so-called 'neat' massage parlors…
Speak up. I am not mongamous despite having been married to a Dutch woman for 35 years, with whom I have traveled almost all over the world. During that time I did share the bed with several ladies. I think this is completely natural. The monogamy is only forced upon you by the different religions in the world. Some are these are hypocritical mongam then only applies to the woman. After the passing of my wife, I left for Thailand (I have known this country since 1964.
I live here with a Thai man for 7 years now. But I'm not monogamous and this suits me just fine.
What doesn't know what doesn't hurt (for both sides)
Why do all those farangs always have the same name: “Darling”.
It is so easy for an enterprising woman, one name and many appearances.
Indeed Henk Hauer, monogamy is forced upon you in some religions.
In other religions it is unthinkable for a man to be faithful to his only wife!
There is a huge difference between sincere love and sexual desire.
With sincere love, marriage is a seal of these mutual feelings and the happiness of the spouse is of paramount importance.
Indeed, for those who prioritize gratification or monetary interests, monogamy is absolutely unnecessary.
To each his way of life.
After all these male reactions, mine as a woman for a moment.
“She loves Shane dearly, but if he's not in Thailand, she doesn't have to live like a nun, does she? Well then! After all, sex is something physical and does not necessarily have to have anything to do with love.”
Totally agree!
In love, sex is both binding and reconciling. But there is also sex for relaxation or pleasure, which does not mean infidelity to the beloved. Many men know about it. And that also happens to be true for women.
What the American should have discussed before his marriage examination is how she views a monogamous marriage and that he would like it. The moment she sees it differently, he knows what he is getting into. Even then she can say yes and do no, but she knows how he stands and what risk she takes if she does cheat.
of course it is acceptable, you sometimes go out for dinner with someone else. Only sex with someone else is not acceptable for everyone, just like going out for dinner with someone else. Sex with one partner is a rule set up by the elite, supported by the clerical, to curb the fornication among the plebs, while they themselves went on as before. There is no culture in which 'adultery' is a given, so normal. So about playing.
Let's assume we are talking about a relationship between two adults.
A relationship is primarily based on mutual trust and that means that one has no secrets from the other. If you do have it or think you should have it, there is something wrong with the mutual trust.
In addition, you can agree on anything you want with your adult partner in good consultation and with the consent of both sides: about raising children, about money, about sex with someone else. Many Thai people find it strange that I have forwarded my phone to my wife. If I don't answer the phone (because I'm in class or in a meeting) she answers the phone. What if a female person calls? Yes, I'll explain that.
I am now 64, have three daughters and therefore a past, also sexual. I'm not a virgin, neither is my wife. So someone may be calling from the past. Very normal if you deal with it normally.
As a foreigner you soon find that type of attractive women with main activities going out and dating. If you are also away from home for weeks, they will fall back into what is normal for them.
Don't get married if you want to live life to the fullest.