Search for missing football players: Strong criticism of police commissioner and governor
Now that the search for the twelve soccer players and their coach, who are trapped in the Tham Luang cave in Chiang Rai, is already entering its second week, criticism of a number of those involved is growing. Deputy Chief Commissioner Srivara and Provincial Governor Narongsak in particular have been criticized for being incompetent.
Governor Narongsak would be especially incompetent to lead the operation. Only one person is satisfied with his inspiring leadership: himself.
According to Bangkok Post columnist Kong Rithdee, Deputy Chief Commissioner Srivara appears to be a real official who is mainly concerned with procedures and protocols. For example, he asked rescue workers who used drones whether they had a permit. He also thought it was strange that the parents had not yet reported the missing of their children to the police. On social media, Thai expressed their anger and criticism towards Srivara. He has since apologized for his actions.
There was also little appreciation for Prime Minister Prayut who visited the disaster site on Friday. Planning and coordination came to a standstill as a result. Prayut had to be informed with charts and maps and had himself extensively photographed. He arrived with quite a procession of press, photographers and limousines. His comment about the election was considered inappropriate by many.
'Search is hampered by poor coordination'
In 'The Nation' Lerpong Suansang, head of the rescue services, complains that a lot of precious time is lost due to the lack of proper coordination between the different rescue teams. For example, shafts that had already been examined and did not provide access were re-examined by other teams. To prevent the same places from being investigated by different teams, good coordination and communication with other rescue teams is of great importance and that is lacking.
Source: Bangkok Post and The Nation
Why doesn't this surprise me anymore? No matter what complicated things happen here in Thailand, it's always the same story, incompetence, bureaucracy and corruption.
Good heavens, isn't there a person who can write things down on a graph and know which team is going to dig or climb where.
There were also Seals from the USA??
And that man from Belgium, that diver.
Cooperate with another diver/Seal.
IS THERE NO ONE WHO CAN BRING ANY STREAMLINE??
We're talking about 13 people here and that's going to ask a deputy chief constable if they have the right papers to do all this.
Well, then he can also get through immigration right away, because I don't think any visas have been issued.
All I hope is that they all get saved and then someone with just over 2 gray cells steps up and makes sure that a big lump of cement is poured into that entrance.
A gate in front with a sign forbidding entry into the cave is only an invitation and costs human lives.
Last Thursday it was already mentioned that there is little oxygen in the cave.
Fingers crossed.
LOUISE
Well, planning, coordination, preventive, etc. They remain difficult concepts. It's starting to look more and more like a daily ego show: a lot of old hours with the press and making sure your good side comes into the picture with cap and decorations. Everyone with (in themselves) good intentions arrives and starts digging, descending, diving, etc.
All the same, the relevant coach of the team has gone quite wrong: entering the cave in the dangerous period, without permission. He should have trained the boys/let them play football and then possibly treated them to an ice cream. But certainly not take an excursion to the cave.
A heard point: they took shelter from the rain has also been taken down. 1 member of the team didn't go to the cave-excursion because he had to be home on time!!
I'm afraid it won't work out. Unfortunately.
I am glad to read that more and more people are doubting the competences of the Thai rulers, because when I posited this here earlier this week, I was burned down by several people as a know-it-all and lazy chair-sitter and so on and so forth.
I based my comment on what I read myself, but even more so on what I heard from my wife who continuously follows the Thai news and all other media.
Apparently many people still wear the well-known rose-colored glasses and see this as a personal attack. But when I'm in Thailand and then watch the news there, I always get sick of all those law enforcement officers who appear on the television when they've caught a 'criminal' and with their stars and stripes behind the suspect, gleaming with pride.
Then I think I'm going to really work on being subservient and vigilant instead of this charade.
Again I think the ordinary Thai are generally sweet, friendly, helpful and hospitable, but it's just such a shame that the people who call the shots are so busy with self-enrichment and corruption and therefore incompetent people are in many places.
Rob,
I completely agree with you what says about the Thai rulers and the ordinary Thais.
Ridiculous that the prime minister, the army commander and the police chief go there with an entire entourage and get in the way of the real aid workers. Puppet indeed.
But it was about the relief effort in this disaster. Any assistance in such a situation is inadequate. When I see how quickly they have intervened with many people from home and abroad in an extremely dangerous and difficult situation, I think that the assistance is quite good. I wouldn't know, and no one knows, how it could have been better. That's what it was about.
And if I had stood by that cave with my son and read the text on the warning sign, I might very well have gone in too.
Don't worry. As far as I'm concerned, I still stand by my response. (that people can't resist waving their little finger.)
Indeed and this usually from their easy chair… . And that's not just about this rescue. It is an unstoppable urge in some and every opportunity is seized.
Were mistakes made and will there be more? Undoubtedly it will be. But don't think that this would be any different if a rescue operation were to take place in the Netherlands. And that doesn't have to have to do with caves...
If one has not been found after all this time, there will automatically be criticism, preferably from people who watch it from a distance and see the well-known clock but do not know how to hang the equally well-known clapper ...
Soon, after the umpteenth attempt and after they have finally reached the children, there will be someone here who claims that he always said that they should have started with that last hole…
And then if one brings up newspaper articles by journalists who like to impose their opinion, perhaps one should state everything as it starts with “This commentary is about another lesson not learned in Thailand, not about the rescue itself. ”
That Deputy Chief Commissioner Srivara and Provincial Governor Narongsak may not be doing their job properly may well be. In the Netherlands, too, there will be people in a position where the appointment has been made on the basis of networks instead of competencies.
So is Lerpong Suansang, head of the rescue services, who says that a lot of valuable time is lost due to the lack of proper coordination between the various rescue teams.
Then that is a man who tries to pass on his own ignorance to others, because isn't it one of the main tasks of a chief rescue service to ensure that there is good coordination between the various rescue teams?
But to stick to the articles anyway.
It also states that “Reaction to Pol Gen Sivara's much-criticized role in the rescue operation was in stark contrast to those officials hailed by the citizens as heroes of the hour”.
I'll make the effort to translate “Reaction to Pol Gen Srivara's much-criticized role in the rescue operation stands in stark contrast to those officials hailed by citizens as heroes of the hour.
And rest assured I've long since shed those rose-colored glasses. Such statements are usually made by people who prefer nothing more than waving their finger everywhere when it comes to Thailand. Maybe put on the right glasses instead of pink or black.
Certainly I also respond from the lazy chair, but it has been in Thailand for 8 years. So maybe right to speak. I am therefore not surprised when messages like this come along about ignorance. what else do you want when positions like governor and chief of police are obtained not by proven ability but by pay. From the armchair I recently saw my nephew being promoted to the local police in Bangkok. Had to put 1 million baht on tables. Mothers has sold her piece of rice land to promote her son. My girlfriend's son can join the railway after 300.000 cash. Nobody talks about competence. Certainly there will be good ones, but the system makes incompetence likely.
My chair is also in Thailand, but whether it is in Thailand or in the Netherlands or in Belgium, if you are not directly involved in that rescue operation, you know nothing about it.
Here is just some shouting about the rescue without knowing the details.
So it is very easy to wave a finger about how it should all be done.
The real rescuers are in the cave and believe they didn't pay anything to be there.
To dismiss that with “there must be some good ones among them” is low to the ground.
Check it out from your armchair…..
Reading well is an art, apparently. I'm not talking about the field workers who take enormous risks in that cave, but about those who should direct them. Isn't that what the message was about?
Indeed, that is an art. So read well.
Did you really think those two were directing those people?
And just like your whole story about your nephew has nothing to do with this, although I quite understand that you wanted to give an example.
By the way, did you think that politicians in, say, the Netherlands or Belgium do not buy in? Maybe not so obvious, but it happens.
I'm from the middle of Brabant, so we don't know much high water. But as Dutch people we have a feeling for the danger of water. And that is why we also know what we can do about this nuisance.
In Aug-Sept it can be haunted throughout Thailand and thousands of pumps and pumping stations are working to keep the water out of the Bankokse streets and pump it back into the river.
Would it then be impossible to empty those caves with a few hundred pumps?
It is sometimes very sad that we Dutch or Belgians are sometimes ridiculed if any comments are made about things that take place in this country.
Always those comments to be a guest in this oh so beautiful Thailand.
We are allowed to have free speech, the Thai does not have it. I myself think that everything others describe above is the harsh reality and I completely agree with that. Really hope they get saved despite the incompetence.
In part I agree with Rob it is apparently another charade as it looks. As a former police chief, I don't think it's appropriate that there are always hats visibly walking around that don't roll up their sleeves themselves. Of course you have your people who do the implementation and they are important. That's where the knowledge lies and they will have to get the job done. We must hear the information about that and that can be done through a spokesperson, because then it remains central and the matter must be managed through a formed leadership team. That's where those caps should stay focused. Everyone does his part. That leadership team has the coordination and the overview and takes decisions in consultation with the experts. So if that doesn't work then yes it will be a mess. Rules must be allowed to give way where there is a need for haste and who would start talking about that now, incomprehensible and typical of the leader type. One thing is important, get those kids out again, because I think we are still waiting for a miracle if people survive this after such a long period. As long as we haven't spoken to those children, it will all be speculative what really happened. The football team went into the cave with premeditation, that is known. But how things went in the cave, I can imagine everything and it must be terrible for this group of young people.
It's so easy to point the finger afterwards. The reality is that in a crisis like this, no one has experience. Every crisis is completely different and being well prepared is practically impossible. It is often a matter of having to improvise time and time again in order to be able to face unexpected obstacles.
The first reaction of many is to help on the spot. This often leads to chaos and excessive concentration of aid workers without a clear command structure. It will only get better after a few days. That is the case in Thailand, but actually everywhere in the world. Only when you yourself have been intensively involved in a disaster or crisis does this become clear.
In a crisis, it is therefore important to set up a clear command structure and unambiguous spokespersons as soon as possible. In Thailand this is often so difficult because government bodies normally do not cooperate well and share information. Every government body is strongly top-down and only at the top there is any consultation.
What I do see in the media now is that things have improved. There is now 1 spokesperson from the governor. That governor does not have to be an expert at all, as he is accused of here. He only has to make decisions based on information from experts.
I don't think that the arrival of PM Prayut has slowed down the actual work in the cave itself. You may of course wonder why he and some other top executives had to be there so necessary. The reality is that a PM who is not on site will be beaten again for that very reason.
General Sia Vela (wasting time), as Pol Gen Srivara is now called in Thai social media, should have just stayed at home. Unlike his boss, he had no business there at the cave.
The question must be asked why the cave was not closed. There is a sign that this cave is dangerous during the July-November rainy season, but it seems to me that the rangers on site saw that the rainy season had started much earlier this year.
There are actually two ways to respond to an unforeseen disaster. One is a centrally managed organization that makes decisions about all aspects of the disaster (from logistics to the involvement of experts, volunteers, traffic and communication). There are a number of scenarios for this and there are courses in crisis management. That each disaster is completely different seems to me very exaggerated given the increasing number of floods, hurricanes, plane crashes, coups d'état and volcanic eruptions to name a few. There are general rules that can be derived from good and bad experiences from the past. Although you would expect from a more authoritarian regime such as the current one in Thailand that the situation would be tackled in a militarily organized manner, this is not the case in my opinion.
The second way is an interesting one. Have taken a course in chaos management in the distant past. Instead of wanting to arrange everything as well as possible (which is an illusion), chaos management says that you should not arrange anything at all. What happens then? The problems that arise are solved organically (as nature works). There is a more natural division of tasks and responsibilities that everyone agrees to without much criticism. The problem is that this solution is not accepted socially because we are all control freaks when we end up in some kind of disaster situation.
Chris,
“The fact that every disaster is different seems to me an exaggeration” you write, and then give a few examples.
If you have not been actively involved in disasters or rescues yourself, you have no idea how both emergency services (professionals & volunteers) and victims react. You may have read all the scenarios and followed courses (and I have had to do that a lot in my work in the past), the reality on site is always so fundamentally different that you have to keep improvising.
I experienced this myself just after the tsunami, where I manned the EU office in Takua Pa in Pangnga after 3 days in the Bangkok crisis center.
Certainly, that has been an experience that has stayed with me (and with me with many others), but whether that experience can still be used usefully in a similar disaster is the question. The next tsunami disaster may not take place in our lifetime or may happen tomorrow. Techniques and tools available at the time are now outdated, and many aid workers are now old or deceased.
It is and remains important to set up a good command structure and, in the current social media era, to have a good and unambiguous spokesperson. The rest continues to improvise based on which obstacles you encounter.