Thousands of Thais demand democracy and monarchy reform
(Suptar/Shutterstock.com)
An estimated 20.000 protesters gathered in Bangkok yesterday. This made this protest one of the largest ever held in Thailand. The protesters will continue their actions today. They demand a new constitution and an end to the military-dominated government. There was also a call for a reform of the monarchy, a loaded subject in the country.
Although this was not allowed, the protesters flocked to Sanam Luang, the main square near the Grand Palace. The police had forbidden the demonstrators to do so, but they were not deterred. They said they want to reclaim the land next to the palace. “Return power to the people”, is the motto of their action. They demand new elections, a new constitution and an end to the intimidation of political activists.
The demonstration started on Saturday at the Tha Prachan campus of Thammasat University. The demonstrators camped at Sanam Luang last night and today are marching in a long protest march to a new location that has been kept secret (not the Government House as previously announced).
(Suptar/Shutterstock.com)
Last night there were several speeches on a podium set up in the square. The speeches were interspersed with music.
Human rights lawyer Arnon Nampha gave a speech announcing that protesters will erect a new plaque on the Royal Plaza on Sunday morning commemorating the 1932 revolution that ended absolute monarchy. The plaque disappeared in 2017 and was replaced by one with neutral text. By whom is unknown.
The protesters also included political leaders including party leader Pita Limjaroenrat (Move Forward) and some MPs from his party, former Future Forward members such as Thanathorn Juangroongruangkit, Piyabutr Saengkanokkul and Pannika Wanich, now of the Progressive Movement; Chaturon Chaisang, former Thai Raksa Chart member and Parit Wacharasindhu, former Democrat member.
(Thitiphon Kengsanguansit / Shutterstock.com)
It was also striking that a number of demonstrators wore red shirts. The UDD (red shirts) kept a low profile for a number of years, but now want to support the student movement that is taking the lead and organizing the protests.
Demonstrators were also able to sign a petition calling for new laws such as a new alcohol law and a law regulating the right to abortion. There is a lot of interest in the initiative proposal of the Internet Dialogue on Law Reform (iLaw) for a draft constitutional amendment with the aim of drawing up a new constitution that will be supported by the people. The proposal, with names and signatures, will be submitted to the House of Representatives on Tuesday.
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There were also protests from Thai people living abroad. People took to the streets in nineteen cities: Taipei, Tokyo, Gold Coast (Australia), Sydney, Wellington, Vancouver, Los Angeles, Winnipeg, New York, Oslo, Copenhagen, Paris, Helsinki, Stockholm, Hamburg, Berlin and Pristina (Kosovo). ).
The demonstrations continued without incident.
Source: Bangkok Post
Quote:
Human rights lawyer Arnon Nampha gave a speech announcing that protesters will erect a new plaque on the Royal Plaza on Sunday morning commemorating the 1932 revolution that ended absolute monarchy. The plaque disappeared in 2017 and was replaced by one with neutral text. By whom is unknown.'
The original plaque commemorating the revolution of 1932 that converted the absolute monarchy into a constitutional monarchy was installed in the road surface by the First People's Party on the Royal Plaza.
This plaque was replaced in 2017 by a plaque praising the monarchy.
This morning the demonstrators, who called themselves the Second People's Party, installed a new plaque in the road surface on Sanam Luang. This plaque bears the text 'The land belongs to the people and not to the king'. It also contains an image of the three-finger gesture and the date. And the human rights lawyer Anon added in a speech to the text '….as we have always been lied to'.
The demonstration was then ended at about nine o'clock. Further protest marches mentioned earlier were cancelled.
Well, the plaque on the Sanam Liang saying 'the land belongs to the people and not the king' was removed last night as expected.
What I forgot to tell you but which is funny: the plaque was dedicated by some kind of Brahmin priest dressed in white. He prayed. But also placed a curse on those who would remove the plaque again. Sexual impotence would be their punishment…TIT
It will be quite a challenge to find the perpetrators because many Thai men are impotent.
It might be nice to mention that the text on the second People's Party plaque is a quote from the announcement of the Peoples Party (คณะราษฎร,Khana Ratsadon). They ended the absolute monarchy in 1932. The removal of the first (and now also the second) people's plaque, the removal of other symbols referring to 1932 and the very appearance of symbols that honor the time before 1932 has been the source of all kinds of rumours. Who, what why? Is it a gentleman or family behind this, royalists (with or without the consent of…) or in the world of conspiracies: are it precisely anti-royalists who hope to inflame resistance by turning back time? Thailand is a very special country in which nothing is what it seems, isn't it? kuche kuche.
Good that the Thai people are starting to stand up more and more.
They are indeed right to complain about the current government and their laws and regulations.
I hope they don't give up, and really the police (whoever are ordinary people) should be at their side instead of stopping them,
It's just a pity that protesting will not change much with a military regime.
There may be a “coup” of the “ordinary” people one day.
The soldiers have to go back to their barracks. The Constitution, (which was modeled after the French example in 1932), should be rewritten and contain guarantees that the interests, freedoms and rights of the population are guaranteed and respected. The 'state system' must be reformed according to contemporary standards, with its seat in Bangkok and not Munich. If the young people are able to enforce that the rule of law is established in Thailand, Thailand will have a wonderful future. But I am afraid that the ideals of the young people will be hijacked by all kinds of power blocs, be it yellow, red or green. Thailand still has a long way to go, little will change and it will remain unsettled for many years to come. There is still too much division. In various European cities, sympathizers have expressed their support for the protest in Bangkok. In Munich at a certain hotel, sympathizers were jeered away by "generous" supporters. They were told to travel to Thailand once, then they would beep differently. Police broke up the meeting there.
The man is not in Germany because the beer tastes so good there, but because he periodically needs medical treatment in a specialist clinic.
Okay, Chris, that is very possible although I suspect that treatment can also be done in Thailand.
Maybe you can also answer this question. Why are the Thai people not officially informed of this truth? Why should a Dutch expat make this known to the world? I really appreciate your answer.
That he needs medical treatment has been in the press for some time. It's really too much credit to assign the scoop to me.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/royal-privilege-thai-king-maha-vajiralongkorn-flouting-coronavirus-lockdown-33xfhbx0c
https://www.mmtimes.com/opinion/21581-a-crown-prince-and-german-affairs.html
https://medium.com/zenjournalist/%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A5%E0%B8%B5%E0%B8%A2%E0%B8%B8%E0%B8%84-1edb2f4465d0.
As far as my information goes, the best therapy cannot be applied in Thailand. And you know as well as I do that the elite of this world are customers of the best doctors and hospitals because they only want the best of the best. And to be honest, if I had a LOT of money I'd probably do the same thing to get better.
Okay. And then this question:
"Why are the Thai people not officially informed of this truth?"
Estimates of the number of demonstrators vary. From 20-30 thousand in the afternoon to 30-50 or 60 thousand in the evening. However many there were, let's keep it at tens of thousands, a clear signal has been sent to the regime.
It wasn't easy for the organizers yet. For example, the police confiscated sound equipment, books, etc. A company and employees of companies that would arrange mobile toilets were also approached by the police not to do so and some vehicles were stopped by the police. Despite such obstacles, we managed to build a large stage with professional screens and speakers (which would not be out of place in a large open-air concert). About half of the Sanaam Loewang lawn was occupied. See for example the second photo on this page:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/09/20/thousands-thai-protesters-call-royal-reform-biggest-gathering/
Speaking of obstacles, the large boulevard towards government house and royal plasa has been closed off by the authorities with concrete blocks of 1 and 1,5 meters high plus military barbed wire (razor wire). Was more like digging in for an armed mob. The demonstrators, however, remained peaceful. They called for the constitution to be rewritten (so that the royal family is also fully covered by the constitution, the senators are no longer appointed by the former junta, etc.) and the government should resign.
The plaque was first wanted at either royal plaza (a stone's throw from the old parliament building near Dusit) or government house. This new 'plaque of the people' is an unofficial (and therefore illegal, you could say) replacement for the original plaque that the People's Party placed last century. That historical plaque then miraculously disappeared one night and was unofficially (and therefore just as legal or illegal) replaced by a plaque praising the monarchy. That thing is still there, although there are often plants on it so that no one can see it. It remains to be seen whether the authorities now adhere to the same standard: leave that new plaque - possibly with some plants on top, this government loves that, see also the green jungle on and around Democracy Monument - ... or whether a double standard and will remove this plaque. Thailand is a special country so I actually assume the latter.
Sources:
– Khaosod English, Prachatai, Thisrupt live video reports (see Facebook) and:
- https://prachatai.com/english/node/8806
- https://prachatai.com/english/node/8807
Prachatai also has the photo of the crowd on the field, but a bit bigger:
https://prachatai.com/journal/2020/09/89600
quote: “……………about 20.000 demonstrators in Bangkok. This made this protest one of the largest ever held in Thailand.”
I doubt that this demonstration is one of the largest in Thai history. I live in Bangkok and have experienced much bigger ones in the last 10 years:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Thai_political_protests
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013%E2%80%932014_Thai_political_crisis.
I must confess that although I am a strong supporter of change in this country, I am quite skeptical about these demonstrations because I believe there is no clear strategy. I have a number of reasons for this:
1. the list of requirements tends to increase over time. And the requirements are internally inconsistent and therefore confusing. From the resignation of the government to the abolition of the Privy Council and Wai Khru, to new legislation on alcohol and abortion (why not on another education system, on gambling/casinos, on getting your driver's license). They throw everything into a heap and thus divide the possible supporters and support.
2. “If you do the same as before, don't expect different results” (seems to be from Einstein). In the past, demonstrations have yielded nothing except loss of blood. In the age of the internet and technology, demonstrations are no longer the usual way to force changes and are also relatively easy to stop by the authorities. See also developments in Hong Kong and Belarus. In the latter country, hackers have now published the first 1000 names of police officers involved in arrests and have been warned to disclose more personal data of police officers. In my opinion a much clearer signal than a demonstration.
3. This movement also thinks (again) in terms of us versus them. I have learned (among others through Steven Covey's book, the 5 habits of highly effective people) that you ALWAYS have to think win-win, whether or not because you want to change things. If it is the case that those in power only suffer power and loss of face, the change party will not take place for the time being.
My idea would be to have only 1 demand ('get rid of this government') and to mobilize for this demand everyone who agrees with it (for whatever reasons), even if one may be from a different political current. There is enough dissatisfaction, also in Bangkok, among the middle class and the elite. (And since September 18, doctors and hospital staff have now contracted the government of 64 hospitals to treat people under the 30-Baht scheme). All other matters can be arranged 'democratically' if the government resigns.
Quote:
"In the past, demonstrations have yielded nothing except loss of blood."
Is that so Chris? Have you forgotten October 1973 and May 1992? There was a lot of blood loss because the army wanted to suppress the protests. In the end it worked.
Oh wait, Suthep and supporters also had success with their strategy in 2013-14. That strategy was: Shutdown Bangkok, occupy government buildings, forcibly prevent elections and profanely insult the incumbent prime minister.
The current demonstrations are peaceful, friendly, humorous and clear in their aims. I agree with you that constantly adding new requirements is not wise. But simply demanding the resignation of the government is not enough. Without an amendment to the constitution, a general will be elected as Prime Minister with the help of the Senate, and we don't want that, do we?
@Tino,
Changes are needed, but do you believe that the country will get into a positive flow if the majority, or the low-skilled, are in charge.
Nothing against the low educated because they have been put in that position or have chosen it, but there is a danger that very opportunistic decisions can be made that will destroy the country.
From your messages you have a son and you are a bit older .. would you yourself have the confidence that you and his friends will give you a better daily life? Or is it about the principle that we must be able to trust each other, which in my opinion is something very unnatural?
Johnny,
I know many poorly educated people with healthier views than highly educated people. And I know highly educated people with stupid ideas. Yes, we have to trust each other, and that has nothing to do with education.
I'll tell you a true fairy tale.
Once upon a time there was an Englishman, sometime in the early part of the last century, who wanted to know what the average intelligence of the people was.
He dragged an oversized ox to a market and asked the spectators to estimate the weight of the ox. Those estimates varied widely, from as much as 500 to 900 kilos. But the average of all those estimates was only a few pounds off the ox's true weight.
High and low educated together, Johnny, that's my vision. Not one of the two. We all need to have some input for a good future.
Elections alone will not get you there because it is structurally wrong. The 3 (or 4, it is not about 1 single club) points are:
1) New elections (the previous ones were not exactly fair and democratic)
2) New constitution (the current one is a monstrosity with a senate that has a lot of influence, read: military influence)
3) Stop the harassment of critics (the visits from the police, the SLAPP charges against activists, labeling critics as un-Thai, land haters, that there is a dark force from abroad behind it etc)
And then the 10-point plan of another group, which I summarize here as point four:
4) Reform the monarchy so that it is fully constitutional (such as the UK, Japan, etc.).
But if 3 or 4 points is too difficult to explain, I suggest making it 2 points:
1) New constitution (This can still be done today by restoring the last democratically established constitution, the one from 1997! And then amending it a bit because that constitution was not perfect either).
2) New elections (this time democratically with a really neutral electoral council, no bizarre change in the distribution of seats, etc.).
Point 2 is only possible if there is a good, democratic foundation. Otherwise it's pointless. You are not going to build a new wall if the foundation of your house is rotten. Point 1 can be a sub-point of adapting that one house so that it is in line with what can be expected from a modern house.
We shouldn't talk about the intimidation (sometimes to death) if that makes things 'too complicated' (not clear)?? Difficult story...
The real problem in the development of democracy in Thailand is NOT elections and is NOT the constitution. The real problem is the implicit definition of democracy as the absolute power of the majority to the exclusion of consideration of the wishes of the minority. There applies to the two well-known camps red and yellow. Who has the power, who can impose his will on the other, who can profit financially from the power. Only words about together but never actions.
Who wins the elections and how (with whatever models and calculation methods) is no guarantee for the democratic functioning of the winners. New elections therefore solve nothing but nothing and may not even need to be held. To think that this government is reinstating the 1997 constitution is the height of naivete. Maybe it's time Thailand didn't have a constitution. After all, it determines the ways in which political parties and institutions interact and is more or less a reflection of current and accepted practice. But if people in Thailand cannot agree on that, it may be an option not to have a constitution in an interim period. Also gives much more leeway to politics after the government has left.
Therefore: down with the government and then a public discussion about the main problems in this country and how to solve them. And not fall into things (like elections, but different, and the next version of a constitution) that are ineffective.
Quote “Thinking that this government will restore the 1997 constitution.” So I don't think it will happen. It is something that would be easy if the will were there, but those in power do not want a healthier foundation for democracy and the rule of law. Things are being stretched: a committee, referendum, talks, Prayut saying that adjustments will take 2 years and will be quite expensive. It's a matter of stretching and holding off the boat. Who else falls for that?
Oh and maybe I can advise you to stop thinking in red versus yellow? There is at least a third camp (orange, youth, …). And if you really look closely you can discover even more visions than 2-3 groups.
No, Chris, the biggest problem in Thailand is that a small minority imposes their views and wishes on the majority. But you are right that there are far too few mutual discussions.
In brief. I see a lot in a decision-making body consisting of a group of randomly chosen citizens in which political parties and elections are abolished. Every so often a new group of say 500 people. A cross section of the population.
I always smile a little when I read the emphasis on MILITARY when it comes to government. How bad the military government is etc.
people conveniently ignore that previous, non-military, governments are the basis of the decline here in Thailand. previous, non-military, governments filled their own pockets and the pockets of their “inner circle” on a large scale.
it is very easy to create a breeding ground for unrest, discontent and demonstrations in times of crisis (such as now due to COVID-19). Would a non-military government really have done so much better here? I venture to doubt it.
Dear Hans, do you know dictator Field Marshal Sarit? He had 2,3 billion baht in assets when he died. In many other governments (often also military) things were not much better with grabbing and corruption. Yes, also under Thaksin, but that is not someone who held democracy in high regard. His sister, the penultimate prime minister, did a lot better in that respect.
The protests, the anger is not about the Covid crisis. The noise about dissatisfaction about the lack of democracy, lack of freedom, looking down on the plebs, intimidation and so on has been going on for some years now. In its most recent form, Future Forward provided a platform for this. This has been suppressed by the corrupt rulers and the rotten system they have set up with, among other things, unfair elections and ten that turned out not to be enough, dissolution of the party. That made the youth take to the streets. See the pre-Covid student protests.
Then listen to their demands again and ask yourself where the country could stand in terms of what they are asking for: democracy, freedom of expression, transparency, accountability and so on. In short, a healthy constitutional state. I think that would do better than many governments to date.