About travel advice to Thailand and disappointed tourists
In large parts of Thailand disaster is about to unfold, that is now clear. Given the poor conditions and the expected problems for the capital Bangkok, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs decided in all its wisdom to tighten up the travel advice.
To the anger and frustration of tourists, the calamity fund then says: “Floods? They belong to Thailand. We will not make any payments. And wish you a happy holiday”
Covered
When you book a package holiday with a tour operator affiliated with the ANVR, you are obliged to pay for two funds: the SGR and the Calamity Fund. You can compare this with a kind of insurance. The SGR pays out in the event of financial insolvency (bankruptcy) of a tour operator and the calamity fund pays out in the event of a disaster or unrest at the holiday destination. With this we have things well organized in the Netherlands (we think). Because you also take care of one travel– and cancellation insurance, then you are covered from front to back (apologies for the choice of words). So far no dirt in the air.
Tourist
The tourist who has worked hard all year for a three-week tour through the holiday paradise of Thailand, also thinks he has his affairs in order. After all, five payments have already been made: the trip, to the SGR, the calamity fund, the travel insurance and a cancellation insurance. The tourist can sleep peacefully. Until his anticipation is cruelly disturbed by disturbing images on TV of the floods in Thailand. After reading the posts on Thailandblog, his heart sinks completely.
Water
He can already see the images in front of him. A Boeing 747 is exchanged for a seaplane. After landing on a large pond that used to be an airport, he has to transfer to a traditional longtail boat. Complaining doesn't help because he had also booked an excursion to the floating market and a cruise on the khlongs. You wanted a floating market, right? You get a floating market! The largest in all of Asia, so don't complain.
Because this image does not correspond to his dreams of a wonderful holiday in Thailand, he takes the envelope that he received from the travel agency with concern. He quickly calls his travel insurance company information: “We cannot help you, you must contact your travel organization”, he is told. Then he calls his travel agency. "We can't help you, you have to go to the calamity fund". Finally he visits the website of the calamity fund, and it reads (loosely translated):
“A little water? So what? You have your swimsuit with you, right? It often floods in Thailand, so what are you complaining about? Thailand is a big country. Why don't you go to Bangkok and Ayutthaya. How about the south? Also nice.
Rules are rules
Anyone who dives into the small print of the calamity fund can only conclude that they act in accordance with the regulations, the message on the website:
'The Calamity Fund can only limit coverage if there is a threat of a natural disaster or a risk of war situation somewhere. There is no natural disaster in Thailand. That disaster is already happening right now.'
About the same as your fire insurer would say: "we only pay out if your house is slightly on fire, if it is completely burnt down you get nothing".
Although it will all be legally closed, you can still question it. No one could have foreseen a disaster of this magnitude. It's the worst in the last 50 years. And even for Thai standards disproportionate.
The facts
The ANVR also says that nothing is wrong in 'Amazing Thailand'. "Except for some flooding here and there, we can send our travelers to Thailand with confidence," says the big ANVR boss. Just to add that no Dutch tourists have (yet) run into problems.
If you only look at the facts, then it's right like a sore finger. No tourists drowned or washed away. Only among the Thai population, a small 400 deaths is the sad balance.
Of course you could argue that you cannot expect a commercial organization to cancel trips on the basis of 'uncanny feelings' among tourists. On the other hand, they do have a commercial interest in satisfied travelers. Being lenient creates a lot of confidence for the future.
Rebooking insurance
The travel insurers Unigarant and Europeesche have been offering rebooking insurance for a number of years. With this insurance, travelers can rebook their trip at no extra cost if something happens at the destination before departure that spoils the holiday fun. Think of things like a terrorist attack, natural disaster or epidemic. In that case, many holidaymakers want to move to another location. The rebooking insurance ensures that this is possible without extra costs.
In this case, a rebooking insurance could have prevented the necessary problems. However, many holidaymakers do not know about the existence of this insurance. They think that with a contribution to the SGR, Calamity Fund, travel insurance and cancellation insurance, they are already sufficiently protected. Unfortunately that is not correct.
Holidays
Of course, it remains a strange thing that you also have to take out five insurance policies with your package trip to be able to go on holiday with peace of mind. If you also consider that the millions that the SGR and the Calamity Fund have in the bank are managed by people closely involved in the travel industry, then it creates a rather incestuous picture. You can also ask yourself how independent and objective the calamity committee is.
Meanwhile, most holidaymakers, who still have to leave for Thailand, are stressed. Rightly or wrongly, it doesn't matter to me. You should start a holiday relaxed. Surely the calamity fund and the ANVR should also understand that?
Thailand can now use the income of the tourists, and there are plenty of places in Thailand that are dry. You can still have a very nice holiday. Only… the question is whether you want to play the happy tourist in a country where hundreds of thousands of people have lost their jobs, their possessions, are in financial trouble, etc. I wouldn't feel comfortable with that.
I can imagine the position of SGR. There is no acute danger, no cases of illness have (yet) been reported, there is plenty of food and drink available in the south, and many destinations are easily accessible. It only becomes problematic when the airport is flooded and you can no longer fly home.
Well,
Watching my plane take off tonight after deciding not to travel.
Not so much because of concerns about the outward journey, but indeed because of concerns about the return journey. Money isn't the most important thing, although I can't deny that it hurts me to flush my ticket down the toilet after a year of saving. Rationally I have made a good decision, emotionally I only find peace when I know that my flight has landed once and for all in airport oblivion.
The question of whether I did it wisely will always haunt me. I cling to the thought that at least I have a choice that millions of Thai don't have… what is really important in this life?
It is very bittersweet to read on this blog, among other things, that different airlines, even within the same flight alliances as Skyteam, have different interpretations and regulations. And oh yes, we are all doing great socially responsible work together, see corporate social responsibility statement Skyteam, a sincere hoot!
For the people who happen to read this and are still looking for two tickets from Bangkok to Chiangmai tomorrow afternoon, drop me a comment and I'll see what I can do. At least two seats are empty…. certainly of anxious 'Ollanders (those of that water management….(-)
Friends of ours are on the plane now. Probably want to leave for Chiangmai tomorrow. Have asked them to read the blog as soon as they arrive. Since it's difficult to get a ticket now it would be nice to take over your spot.
What now ?
I think it's very sad for Rein that he can flush his ticket (and money) down the toilet.
My husband and I have received a free rebooking at Stip Reizen. We would do a tour through Thailand, departure October 27, so yes today. Yesterday afternoon we received the redeeming phone call from Stip that we could make a rebooking between January and June 2012. We are now going February 9, 2012 for 3 weeks.
Cheers to Stip Reizen
We would also leave October 27th. Just like you got a call saying it's off. We think it is the only correct decision by Stip/BBI. We have now also postponed our trip to February 9, 2012. Well arranged. It appears that not all organizations take this step. Shame. Missed opportunity for them.
Well Henny,
We will then be your fellow travelers with Stip Reizen on February 9th. Until then in a better time for Thailand.
Regards, Alma
I understand that FOX Vacations has also canceled a tour.
fox do something for the traveler? yes for 150 euros pp charge for rebooking
while stip and several org do it for free
tip: read the fox forum to find out what customers think about this
my last trip with fox is this
Very recognizable how badly FOX handles this kind of thing. My experience is not about Thailand but India. But I'll post it because it confirms Iris' answer. I have been traveling with Djoser for years, always been great trips and I recommend it to everyone. This year I unfortunately decided to go with Fox. Just before departure, travel alerts were issued from various countries (USA, Canada, England, etc.) regarding the threat of terrorism. In addition, there was an outbreak of a deadly epidemic (several hundred people died in two months). I called them about this and their reply was that the agent in India knew nothing about it. So I forwarded several links, newscasts, newspaper articles etc. Also with evidence that it was in the areas we would be traveling through with FOX. Again I got the same answer. They indicated that there was no negative travel advice in the Netherlands. I then called the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and she emailed me: There is no such thing as a negative travel advice from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, despite the fact that many people use that term. In addition, the travel advice of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs is not legally binding. Some travel agencies and tour operators inform customers that they will only cancel an already booked trip if the Ministry of Foreign Affairs issues a negative travel advice. This gives the impression that the Ministry of Foreign Affairs plays a decisive role in this. However, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs is not a party to the discussion about whether or not to cancel a trip”. Yet Fox continues to insist that they know nothing (while India itself has also issued a Terror alert, the Indian Minister of Health has been summoned about the epidemic and the International Society for Infectious Diseases has issued a travel alert about an epidemic that is much worse than in previous years). An acquaintance of mine was going to Thailand this month with FOX and also for that (despite the floods) she did not want to cancel free of charge. They were only forced to do so after the intervention of a lawyer. I will travel with Djoser again next year just like the 4 trips before.
Hi Hans,
Completely agree with you, we are an adventurous people and that is not necessarily necessary
to keep out of danger.
Certainly not now. We have family in Bangkok and they are still dry,
there are problems with reduced food and water, but no shortage yet.
That is not to say that the situation is not very serious, we live in Naklua in winter
(Pattaya) and that is now completely full of refugees
But… there are still plenty of places where you can stay undisturbed as a tourist.
For us it is a bit different, we are so integrated that we hope to be able to help
offer….
Makes a good case.
And you…don't worry too much it's good for nothing.
Frank
Hans, wouldn't it also be a slap in the face for the Thai whose income depends on tourism if we all stayed away from the areas where there are no problems?
Well unfortunately we have experience with our trip last year in October. A tour of beautiful bounty islands. It was impossible to get off Koh Samui. Hellish boat trips from island to island. And finally decided to fly from Koh Samui to Bangkok by plane when it was possible to fly again. We interrupted our group trip because we were always stuck in a hotel hotel. There I am not in Thailand. Our travel insurance covered our expenses, but the travel organization said time and time again it's not too bad. The travel calamity fund agreed, despite the water being up to our knees.
yes i am going tomorrow. Proceed directly to (busy Pattaya) Just wait and see. Hope I can land and continue to Pattaya
Ruud
I'm also going that way tomorrow, and also to Pattaya. My original plan was to go to BKK, but due to the forecast for major floods, I finally managed to get a room in Pattaya and a good friend who can pick me up from the airport.
Do you happen to fly with Eva Airways?
no china. Good trip. I also have taxi and room .
We are also going to BKK tomorrow. Would first stay in BKK for 2 days, but now go straight to Jungle Rafts (they float anyway) and then to the north. Never been to Thailand but go with mixed feelings.
Eva row 29H and K
Ron, see KLM website, you can reschedule from 10.00 am this morning !!
@ Ron then we are close together… I am at 26C 🙂
If you still need some advice, I can still update you. I am a fairly experienced Thailand-goer and can reassure you…
Let me know!
Hi Ron, we have been in Bangkok for 2 days now, close to the river (khao San) where it is fortunately still dry. If you have an organized trip I wouldn't worry too much, the airport is just dry and the rest of Thailand (outside flood area too).
We are here on spec (for the 6 x) and therefore have to sort everything out ourselves, which causes some uncertainties at the moment. Information provision is not too good (maybe ,maybe). But we are flexible and have more than a month.
A travel organization will not just send tourists into the unknown here, and you just have a good chance that you may not see anything from the flood.
Cheers,
Michiel
Have a good holiday if you go.
Ps Despite the disaster, it is just 32c here. So no one suffers from the cold.
NB ! At the moment there are no hotel rooms available in Pattaya.
Frank
Okay Frank, but I have a room. I think it will calm down after a few days. It also depends a lot on what the tidal waves of today and Monday will do. Haven't heard anything yet!!
The north is left out of this discussion, but is still perfectly passable. Chiang Mai and its surroundings are completely free of water. Chiang Rai and other places are also excellent to travel to. There is much to experience and see here.
My advice is just to fly from Bangkok to Chiang Mai. In this way you also help the tourist sector to get through these difficult times and enjoy yourself. Just a different holiday in a different part than bangkok, pattaya or phuket.
Just don't get the people, Thailand is easy to travel, no problem in the north and the Isan country.
The south there you can also go for a beach holiday without doom or gloom.
Bangkok center is also doable (Kao San Road, just some suburbs are the bottlenecks (underwater)
For the rest I would say, people you should not rebook to another South Asian country.
Often the reports (travel advice) are greatly exaggerated by various authorities!!
goodbye:
georgesiam.
Just posted on klm.nl under flight disruptions:
Flooding in Bangkok
Last update: Friday 28 October 2011, 10:00 hours / 10:00 AM (Amsterdam time)
Currently all KLM flights are operating as scheduled.
If your journey to, from or via Bangkok is between Saturday 22 October 2011 and Monday 7 November 2011 you may either change your travel dates, or change your destination. Please see below for more information.
KLM will offer the following voluntary re-book options:
1. Change of travel dates
You may re-schedule your travel, using the following guidelines:
•Outbound travel should occur no later than Tuesday 15 November 2011, the original duration of stay may be preserved.
•Penalties and change fees do not apply
•Change of 1 outbound journey and 1 inbound journey is permitted free of charge.
•Re-booking is possible only if seats are available in the same booking class as stated in the original ticket.
•If only a higher booking class then the one stated in the ticket is available, then the difference in fare will be charged when rebooking.
•Rebooking must be completed at the latest on Tuesday 15 November 2011.
2.Change of destination
You may use the full value of your original tickets to buy new tickets of the same or a higher Air France, KLM and/or Delta Air Lines fare, using the following guidelines:
•All penalties/change fees will be waived, even if required by the ticketed fare basis.
•Rebooking must be completed at the latest on Tuesday 15 November 2011.
Refunds
Full refunds will be offered in case of canceled flights and flights delayed more than five hours.
Thursday (Oct 27) we would fly to BKK. Contacted EVa Air in the morning if we could postpone our flight. Within 15 minutes we had an email with our new flight details (November 17). No problem. Fly Eva Air!
From Facebook :
Thai Airways
Thai Airways International provides additional check-in counters at the Airport Rail Link, Makkasan Station to facilitate passengers traveling to Suvarnabhumi Airport during flooding situation. THAI's passenger traveling to Suvarnabhumi Airport by Airport Rail Link may check-in their luggage and personal belongings at THAI's check-in counters, located on 3rd floor, Airport Rail Link, Makkasan Station, starting today from 07.00 hrs. until 21.00 hrs everyday.
The Airport Rail Link check-in service is open for all THAI's flights departing Suvarnabhumi Airport between 10.00 – 01.20 hrs. Passengers must check-in by themselves 3 hours prior to flight departure and receive their boarding pass and luggage tags. This is with the exception of passengers traveling to the USA, on the route Bangkok – Los Angeles, who must check-in at Suvarnabhumi Airport only.
We are going to Thailand with Kras on November 3 for 3 weeks, we fly with EVA airlines. Have been in contact with Kras several times, but always the same answer, journey continues.
What needs to be done to cancel everything…or transfer.
Also had mail contact with the embassy in Bangkok and he said that it is easy to travel outside of Bangkok.
Do you still get it, I don't anymore, given the images on the news yesterday