For a Thai everything is "paeng"
We Dutch have a reputation, just ask a Belgian, to be frugal, even stingy. We do not like to spend money and if we have to, preferably as little as possible.
This blog also regularly talks about all kinds of things that are in Thailand being “expensive”, while forgetting that whatever it is, it always costs (much) less in Thailand than in the Netherlands.
It is undeniably true that many prices in Thailand have risen considerably in recent years and while this also affects foreigners, it is still a major problem for many Thais in the first place. They generally have less to spend than foreign expats or tourists.
So much is "paeng" (expensive) for a Thai, but the word has been dead in their mouths for some time. If a farang buys something of value and tells a Thai about it, he will instantly respond with surprise with “paeeeeng!” Bought way too expensive. Now it is also my experience that a lot of purchases work out cheaper if you have a Thai assist you. You have to be able to trust that Thai and the person who is most suitable for that is of course your own Thai partner. If you don't have one, a good friend can help, although that does not always give the desired result.
Andrew Biggs wrote a column in the Bangkok Post on this subject and the example he cited went something like this (own summary in free translation):
“I needed a new door for my bathroom. Fortunately there is a factory near my house, where I went to have a look. Nice collection and the door that I would like to buy had to cost 3000 Baht. When I told a Thai friend, he was shocked: “Paeeeeengggg! No, he had a good friend who made doors and he would guide me there and help me make a nice deal.
Now that friend lived in Nonthaburi, so we had to go there by car (mine of course). Well, that cost some petrol, but we also had to eat along the way. My friend had brought his wife for fun and so the meal still came to 1200 Baht.
The door, which was most suitable, was of a poor quality and in a color that would not have been out of place in an a gogo tent, but the price was only 1800 Baht. In order not to offend my friend, I bought the door and we returned to my home in Bangkok.
It was difficult to hang the door, also because the hinges were not exactly right, but in the end it worked. Pushing a little hard now and then and the door closed with a huge grinding noise. Some force had to be used to open it.
A few months later, that friend comes to look again and sees to his surprise that the door has been given a different color. I tell him that I indeed did not like the color and that I had the door painted over. What actually happened was that I had had enough of that poor quality door and ordered the factory on my street to install a hardwood door for the aforementioned 3000 Baht.
So, all costs included, I had paid almost 8000 Baht for a new door, where I could have sufficed with 3000 Baht. A good lesson!
A good example of how not to do it, but the fact remains that you can often get a better deal with a Thai. Be careful with the choice of that Thai, because many have a "friend" somewhere who will be recommended to you. If I need clothes, shoes or something like that, I usually go along to look and make a choice. My wife then buys a little later, because she can negotiate better with the Thai seller. Often provides a nice discount.
Recently our water supply system had to be renewed and my wife had a handyman friend come over to make a price. I thought the price was quite reasonable, but my wife said it was "paeng". She sent for three others and then chose one of them. I thought it was all rather exaggerated, but it turned out that she had made a good choice in terms of price and quality.
– Reposted message –
Well, not everything is cheaper in TH, just think of electronics, wine, etc.
But I also tend to find everything expensive in TH, while it costs almost the same in NL.
In NL I easily buy "gadgets" or something to snack on for € 5.00, while when I'm in TH and something costs Thb 200 I often don't take it with me because I think it's too expensive.
The fact remains that in my opinion many things in TH have become much more expensive and in NL many things are cheaper, thanks to the rise of Action, Lidl, etc.
A comparison is made with Tesco, Big C. 7/11 in Thailand: EXPENSIVE
and Action, Lidl, Blokker etc. in the Netherlands: CHEAP.
Similar in Thailand the 10BAHT (or 20BAHT) stores, where the same "stuff" as with the
Action is sold very cheaply.
But yes, a case of beer is 2x as expensive in TH as in the Netherlands.
Thailand sausage drinkers priceless :o)
The price of progress, which we ourselves helped to initiate, although a beer in TH has always been relatively expensive. However, there are many products that are still cheaper, especially the "local products". If you really want Western products (food and non-food), then there is also a Western price tag attached.
That's right, everything has become more expensive.
And yes, we were always regular customers at Aldi.
Good stuff and it couldn't get old because it really went out with cartloads.
But some shopkeepers here in Thailand think tourists are dummies drawn from clay.
In this case especially the sellers from India.
I really experienced the ultimate.
Taylor, zip-up trousers with an elasticated waist and a blouse-jacket with a small stand-up collar.
What do you think???
Without batting an eyelid, this figure dared to ask for 6.550 baht.
And unfortunately this happens in many cases.
They think they can make up for the week with one blow or I don't know what they think about this.
No one will come back to a taylor like that.
It is easy to forget that they can get much more business with normal prices.
Then one orders 2 x or 3 x something similar.
LOUISE
I continue to be amazed by the Indian clothing stores. You rarely or never see a customer and to keep them going there must be turnover. However, there is less nuisance from front-door revolving salespeople who want to lure you in with small talk. For me, these kind of companies are an opportunity for countless Indian businessman to launder their black money, although I have no evidence for this. But my gut feelings rarely let me down.
The tailoring business in Thailand (Asia) and the large price differences are not so much about the work involved (almost all come from the same sweatshops anyway) but about the quality and price of the fabrics used. References to and comparisons of tailors' prices mean nothing without taking that into account.
That quality also has its price in Thailand is simply a fact that is no different in other countries in the world.
When I recently saw the tips on how to book a plane ticket cheaply on this site, it already made me think that many only pay attention to the price.
A price that many do not take into account at all, whether it is a direct flight or a flight with stopovers where you often spend 20 hours and more if you want it even cheaper.
A small meal in a stir-fry container where, if you are lucky enough to get a wooden bench under your ass at all, is compared to a meal from a restaurant, which of course works with much higher costs.
And if possible, they prefer to drag their heavy luggage through half the city at about 37°C to save the taxi, because in their opinion this is so nice and cheap.
And with this being advantageous, I don't even want to get into the fact that many people understand by tipping as normal, if they intend to tip at all.
When a Thai says something is paeng, it usually has to do with the fact, because of their usually meager wages, they have learned to save on everything, while many of us who are clearly better off financially are simply stingy.
React themselves as if they were bitten by a poisonous spider, when it comes to their own income, or that the euro exchange rate is slightly less, while they without hesitation like to use the starvation wages that should offer them a cheap holiday.
Preferably save so much in this holiday, so that you can already book the next holiday from the saved.
@,
Do you think it is not possible that there is also a large group of people who really want to go to Thailand or anywhere else and that this is actually slightly above the budget.
So yes, then these people have to make a distinction how much and what to spend.
Spain flight is cheaper, but they want Thailand, so they do look at prices.
And then it has to be with that extra stopover.
Here too you are very condescending about people who buy a fake watch and put this on the same line that one cannot expect the quality as with the real one.
And we don't talk about the price difference of 50.000 euros, do we?
Not worth it.
Anyone who complains about such small sums, well…………
We also fly up in Bangkok and down in Amsterdam.
And the Thai are really not all below the minimum income.
How do you think all 7-11 stores make their sales?
Only from the tourists?? Not really.
The Thai does their shopping there just as happily, because this 7-11 is right around the corner, so much easier.
So they pay the top price for a small bottle of shampoo, for example.
2 ladies who work with us do this.
And I really like your last line.
So tourists take out the thai to be able to go on holiday again next year??
Bah.
LOUISE
Dear Louise, The above article was about the concept of "paeng", so you can only speak of real paeng if the similar product is clearly cheaper elsewhere,
Under a similar product I tried to make it clear that although a flight with a stopover may be cheaper for many, it cannot really be compared to a direct flight, because this is a completely different product.
I also tried to make it clear that a Chinese fake watch from, for example, Pat Pong, which is actually nothing more than a funny item, can usually not be compared to a cheap original watch from Europe, which does not happen to have Breitling, Rolex, etc. fake is listed.
Even a cheaper watch from Aldi or Lidl from Europe often has better quality, and usually also offers a warranty.
I myself have nothing against people who eat a cheap snack from a plastic container, as long as they do not compare the price of this with a restaurant, because of course it makes no sense.
That not everyone earns a minimum wage in Thailand may certainly be true here and there, although many who earn their money in the hospitality industry must often be concerned.
Two of my wife's nieces worked in a 4* hotel in Chiang Rai, and had to live on their meager basic wages mainly from tips, which were often very scant even with diligence and kindness, or sometimes completely absent.
Even the Whiskey bottles from the Minibar, which had been opened and manipulated in such a way that it was not noticeable that they had been drunk, they had to pay themselves from this meager wage.
Most of these Profiteurs, who tipped little and also indulged in the minibar, came from the pre-wealthy West.
Indeed Louise, for many people such a trip is also a big chunk of their budget and then they look where they can do something cheaper and where something more expensive.
In the years that we were bound by school holidays and school fees, etc., we also opted for the slightly cheaper airlines, now fortunately we can afford a little more and we fly premium economy.
And the 7/11 does indeed exist thanks to the Thai hard workers who perform maximum work for a minimum wage and I sometimes think why do all those people buy here, 100 meters away is a large BigC where they can buy large bottles (so cheaper liter price) sell and my wife says: They would like that, but then their entire daily budget is gone with 1 bottle of shampoo, so no food for that day. That is something that many Westerners should think about
Nice story Gringo. The title seems a bit too short to me, could have been expanded with the fact that for the Thai everything is paeng what the 'farang partner' buys. Also applies in the Netherlands, if I buy corn, coriander, rambutan, etc. on the market here and my Thai partner asks what I paid for it, I usually get to hear that it is 'paeng'. Always have to laugh about it. It is true that prices in Thailand have risen, but overnight stays in star hotels and meals in good restaurants are usually still very reasonable in terms of price. And that also applies to the price of petrol, around 1 euro. A well-known saying is 'Better expensive than not for sale', but that does not apply to most Thai people, who have to make ends meet on a minimum income year after year.
Most Thai people don't have to live on a minimum income at all. Most Thais have a normal income. And a liter of petrol costs 27 Baht, which is anything but 1 euro.
Thailand Blog from 10-4-'18: average income in Thailand per person is 14.000 Baht and per household 25.000 Baht per month. How else would you call that a minimum income? On http://www.globalpetrolprices.com you can read that on 18-6-'18 the average petrol price in Thailand was 35,87 Baht, so about 1 euro.
When you buy something in Thailand, especially at a night market, you naturally ask about the price in advance. Your first reaction should be: WAY TOO EXPENSIVE! Can it be cheaper? Then there is usually a reduction in the price. But then you don't have to pay immediately, because a second round is still possible. At night markets such as in Pat Pong, I could sometimes take the fake bag or watch for 1/3 of the asking price.
But you also have to act for the taxi ride or tuk-tuk ride, if no meter is present. Nowadays almost all taxis have a meter, but in the past you had to decide the price before boarding. And always: much too expensive, can it be cheaper?
My wife is also very thrifty. For 250 baht she buys herself a beautiful dress, but sometimes for less. An hour ago she showed me her new purse: 50 baht!
She hardly cares about shoes either. I am then the one who tries to persuade her to buy more expensive ones, because then you have them for longer and they also run better. She knows, but she can't help it. Exactly my mother when she was alive… every penny was looked at there. Too bad she could only see my wife twice… they had something in common, the two ladies… 🙂
Dear Sjaak, You don't have to teach me how to trade, because I have been in trade all my life.
The fact that you have to trade on a night market to get a fake watch for 1/3 of the price is also no great art, because your Thai wife would usually get it even cheaper.
What I meant is that real quality can never be compared to a Chinese fake watch where even 1/3 of the price still has enough merit for the trader.
If you are satisfied with such a fake watch from a night market, that is your right, although you can of course never compare this with the quality of an original.
Another watch, which may not be a fake from a famous brand, is often bought in Europe in every supermarket with a better quality inclusive. warranty cheaper than your Chinese fake from Pat Pong.
The fact that many Thais, barring exceptions, do not need special quality shoes, is due to the fact that many Thais hate walking, especially in the heat.
If you then cover the greatest distances with a Tuk Tuk, Song taew or motorbike, you can go a long way with a pair of flip flops for 80 Baht or even less.
Someone who moves normally, especially if he lives in Europe, will certainly not get used to such slippers, and will also have to pay attention to the quality.
Been to the Pat Pong market often enough, and have only made the experience with many others, that it is a nice tourist market for a goodie, but you certainly will not find quality here in most cases.
And that's why I stick to my opinion, that when you compare a price, you also have to compare the quality, so that it doesn't become comparing apples with oranges.
Incidentally, my wife is also thrifty, although she slowly finds out that CHEAP is very often EXPENSIVE.
I completely agree with you. I used to buy watches for acquaintances who knew I was going to BKK. Personally, I'd rather have a genuine Casio than a counterfeit Breitling.
I'm talking about twenty years ago...
She never acted at the time, because I didn't know her then. I do see (I didn't write that to you, but in general) that many foreigners are done trading very quickly, because they are not used to it.
As for the shoes: my wife should definitely buy good shoes and not cheap flip flops that fall apart after two weeks of walking (she buys fashion shoes). But I also try to make her understand what you say and she slowly understands that too.
Dear Mr John.
I've thought about giving you an answer to your assumption. I fly with KLM or with Etihad. those prices are really far apart. With Etihad now only 455 Euro with KLM over 600 Euro. With Etihad I have a stop of another half or up to 3 hours as I want. With Etihad arrive in BKK at 7:10 in the morning then have a whole day to go where I want to go. With KLM, that is around noon.
Now I'm taking a stop because my legs are bothering me and I don't want to sit that long anymore. And I don't drag my suitcases either, but I do pay attention to the prices. and at Etihad the food is certainly as tasty as at KLM.
And if I need something, I get it immediately. At KLM, I have never experienced it differently. It's not just about the price but also about the ease and time of arrival for many who fly regularly, I myself don't want to judge other people, Without thinking
Greetings and have a nice flight when you fly again
Dear Slopje, Of course you are right that these flights are often cheaper, I occasionally see flights that take longer than 30 hours and are even cheaper.
Have also regularly flown with Etihad, Emirates, or Oman Air, but if the price difference is not too great, prefer a direct flight.
What I meant is that many people only pay attention to the price, and like to forget or not mention the often long transfer times.
Only mentioning price is then often comparing apples with oranges, because not everyone with a flight wants to be on the road for so long.
If this amount is much larger, everyone can decide for themselves whether they want to purchase these times.
The difference is usually not only the service and the taste of the food, but whether someone is willing to accept these longer times for a cheaper price.
Do you have to fly to and from Bangkok with Lufthansa? It is one of the most expensive airlines (I should know, I worked there for 30 years). The planes are almost always booked out to the last seat. I also know that from personal experience… so not everyone goes for the cheapest flight.
Reputation of a company: reliability, safety (!) and convenience (without stopover) do play a role.
Dear Sjaak, You hit the nail on the head, you can first speak of cheap if you compare the product with a really similar one.
For example, if you compare a direct flight from Lufthansa, KLM, or Thai Airways, and see that one of these 3 companies, which offer almost the same costs less, then you can first talk of a cheap offer.
If we then compare this price with a flight with a stopover, we are actually talking about no fair comparison, because a direct flight is a higher quality product for many people.
Even with a hotel price you can only speak of cheaper, if you can book exactly the same room with breakfast at a certain travel agency.
If you are going to compare this with a hotel across the street, with a slightly larger room, then that is not a fair comparison, and nothing else than comparing apples with oranges.
Even if clothes are beautiful, it remains an unreasonable price comparison if one consists of real cotton or wool and the other of 60% Polyester.
The fact that someone is not willing or able to spend more on a certain product may be cheaper for this person, but really cheaper requires a fair comparison.
To avoid “paeng” from my partner, who always asks how much something has been bought, I take it easy and always state less than the actual price.
Finally, you have to keep the church in the middle.
I hope this post is irony? Not communicating honestly and openly never benefits a relationship. Just be honest about what you're doing, no secrets, no lies (even if there's nothing wrong with it). In the good case, your partner might know how to get a better price/quality, and in the bad case, your partner disagrees about the purchases, but provided they are a relatively fair part of your household budget & income, there should be nothing to worry about are. If you make her pennies on expensive things, I understand that she is not happy with 'too expensive' purchases. If it is your own part of the budget, your partner may show a little more understanding.
NB: @redactie, that photo is beautiful. A clear example of a walletNO! 555 🙂
ha ha,
There is only one budget and that is my budget, otherwise there is nothing to complain about.
And...for the record, we communicate perfectly, for more than 12 years.
What strikes me is the large amount of "junk" that we can buy very cheaply in the Netherlands at, for example, the Hema, Blokken and Action. If I then see that similar (perhaps the same stuff) at 7/11 and Big C have to cost a multiple, then it is clear who takes the profit. That should also be much cheaper in Thailand, right? A store like Action would be a gold mine in Thailand (it already is in NL).
Of course you can also make a cheap move on various markets, but usually not or hardly cheaper than in NL. This does not apply to everyday things, although eg a beer in Thailand is certainly not cheaper in the supermarket than in NL.
Those shops are full of them in TH, you just have to know them as such.
An example is DAISO, which is a Japanese retail chain and starts from Thb 60. Slightly better quality than the 20 Thb shops and on the market. There are several chains with a similar range. Beejte similar to Action in the Netherlands.
And even in Robinson there is now a whole department (I think out of necessity) where many articles are offered for Thb 60.
When I look at my own wallet, I spend more money in Thailand on similar goods than in the Netherlands. It's just what you buy and find important. What strikes me is the diversity of market visitors. My wife has a stall with mussels and other vermin such as crab. The crab is often expensive, also for us when purchasing and is sold with a small surcharge, which makes it even more expensive. Yet this is eagerly deducted and we are clean every day. I would never buy it for this amount (everything has a maximum price for me) but the Thai do buy quality, especially if they like it. So paeng is only a relative concept for a certain group of Thai people. I also regularly see foreign men shopping with Thai women and then it is always, the woman orders and the man takes the cut and often with a questionable face. Whether that questionable face is dependent on the prices remains to be seen.
Why cheap?
Wine : paeeeng!
Beer : paeeeng!
Drinking water : in Thailand, more than 1000 times as expensive as in NL !! Is there a word for that too?
Drinking water 1000x as expensive? What do you pay in Thailand? 5000 baht for a bottle of water? Go buy a bottle of water in the store in the Netherlands… I think it costs about 2,50 Euro. In my opinion, that is significantly more expensive than 7 or 10 Baht.
But of course you are talking about water from the tap. I pay less than 200 Baht per month for my water. We do everything with it: watering the garden, filling up the pond, you name it. And we drink it too. I bought a reverse osmosis installation for that, which didn't cost me an arm either.
Now we're going crazy. Of course it is more expensive with that installation. But: that installation belongs to our house. Buy a house (or rent it) in the Netherlands for the same size as you can do here. Compare that price. It does appear that rent and owner-occupied homes are ten times more expensive in the Netherlands than in Thailand. Power supply and water supply belong to your home. Add those costs to those of the house throughout your life and you will still be many hundreds of Euros or thousands of Thai Baht cheaper in Thailand.
I see it over and over…. there are those who see the glass as half empty and others that it is half full. The few things that are more expensive in Thailand still don't outweigh all the costs you have in the Netherlands.
So um….drinking water? Duration? It costs me a fraction of 200 Baht per month. I would venture to say that my DRINK water from the tap costs me less than 20 Baht for the whole month.
Right Sjaak, my drinking water also comes from a reverse osmosis system and is perfectly drinkable.
We also built a house for us, all the comfort you could wish for, not too big. Cost 1.6 million THB. Everything was included in this price - very spacious IKEA kitchen, beautiful dressing room, beautiful fully finished bathroom, all electrical appliances, new quality furniture and all household goods. In short, everything new and started from scratch. Only the building land we already had. If you ask me dirt cheap compared to Belgium.
I can safely say that our monthly expenses are around 35000 THB. We have more than enough with that. The annual major costs (insurance) are not included here. If you know that my monthly rent in Belgium alone was € 800, I don't want to go back to my home country for any money. I get the good climate for free.
My choice has long been made for me.
Dear Michel and readers of this blog,
finally a price that corresponds to reality. When it comes to prices, it is better not to mention them on this blog, because you can be sure that there will always be those who do better: if you buy something, they can do it much cheaper, if you sell something, they will get more and more than what you got…
That 35.000THB/m in living costs corresponds very well with reality and I know, from experience, that you can really live well on that. I myself have been keeping a kind of bookkeeping here for years, so I know perfectly what the monthly expenses are. I go to Makro every month, where I buy various products that are roughly the same every month. When I then see how much I pay and how and with what my shopping cart is filled, then I have to come to the conclusion that I don't have that in Belgium for that money, would easily amount to double.
Beer expensive? Here we drink, in a normal pub, so no bar with 'garnish', a large bottle of beer for 65THB and on the coast, on the beach, for 90THB (large bottle). That is +/- 1.5 and 2.5Eu respectively…. I would like to see where you can do that in the Netherlands or Belgium in a pub or on the coast….????
With wine being expensive, I agree. Price quality is very bad. That's why I don't buy that 'Chateau Migraine' anymore, except when I need it to cook certain dishes.
For tourists or winter visitors it is completely different and they are not really aware of the life expectancy here in Thailand.
Dear Lung Addie,
Indeed, if you proclaim something here, you sometimes have the chance that your story will be invalidated. I am glad that my estimated estimate of the monthly costs is confirmed by you.
To be clear, I only live with my Thai wife (no children). That 35000 THB is certainly more than enough. I am not a pub visitor, but I regularly go out for dinner. Then the price is not important to us.
Since we don't have to pay rent and we 'only' have to spend 35000 THB, we can save a lot every month. I have a large pension, but I am convinced that little of this amount would be left in Belgium at the end of the month.
I was lucky enough to be able to build here at a reasonable price. You can only dream of that in Belgium. I don't understand the subject of this discussion that 'Thailand' would be expensive. For us foreigners, I think I can say that Thailand is still more than cheap to date. It's just 'how you live' I guess, you can make it as expensive as you want, just use a little common sense 😉