In 2002 Anil Ramdas wrote a sharp column about Pattaya in the NRC
The recently deceased writer, journalist and program maker Anil Ramdas had a sharp pen, sometimes dipped in vitriol. This became apparent in 2002, when he wrote a column in NRC about Pattaya….
Kipling's thesis
Anil Ramdas
Column | Monday 08-07-2002
Nowhere does Rudyard Kipling's idea that East is East and West is West, and
never the twain shall meet as effectively and relentlessly refuted as in Pattaya,
a seaside resort a three-hour drive from Bangkok. I call it a seaside resort, in
arren tired, because no name has yet been invented for such a place. There are people
who call it the red-light district of the world, or the Sodom and Gomorrah of ours
time, but there is a moral judgment in that. The people in Pattaya are standing
far above such judgments. Good and evil in the usual, bourgeois
meaning are not applicable here. Here lawlessness is the law, chaos the
norm, anarchy the conviction, hedonism the duty.
I would not recommend anyone to come to Pattaya. Like you at one
roller coaster has the warning that it is dangerous for heart patients and
pregnant women, also applies to Pattaya: dangerous for heart patients and
pregnant women.
During the day, this danger is not noticeable. During the day, Pattaya is almost an ordinary one
seaside resort, almost Costa del Sol. White tourists sunbathing, swimming, eating. Generally
Hamburgers. I like burgers, burgers represent the world, and the
world is America.
I know people who don't eat burgers because they imperialistic burgers
find. I just wash down my anti-imperialist feeling with a local
brewed beer. Singha, the beer of Thailand, is best to drink.
In the bathrooms of the hotels in Pattaya you will not only find small soaps and
shampoos, but also perfumes and deodorants. Pattaya is very physical, people who
don't smell good have no chance in Pattaya.
We older men have to shave well in the evening and sprinkle, the hair
rubbing with water look gel, that gives something youthful, and of course that cheerful
shirt, printed with red and yellow flowers. The most important thing is the bundle
dollars. Don't come with baths, the Thais don't think much of them
own currency. And please have small denominations. Who with
going out with hundred dollar bills is an unbelievable wimp.
Ten dollar bills are good, the fixed price for a regular number.
You can double it for something extra, or triple it if you're extreme
needs, and you can have them in Pattaya.
The party starts at ten o'clock in the evening. Thank goodness no young people come here
Pattaya. You hardly see tourists under the age of fifty and that is how it is intended.
Pattaya is, how shall I put it, for unattractive men with money and
life experience. Men with big bellies and big moustaches, smiling construction workers
with tattoos, but also skinny men to whom the constipation is on the face
to read. With their buttocks squeezed they walk along the boulevard and through all the
colored neon above the cafes you hardly notice their pallor.
Cafes, bars, nightclubs, live shows (here called fucky-fuckyshows), clubs for
gays with gorgeously made-up boys, clubs where transvestites perform, clubs
for the pedophiles among us, with girls under fourteen.
The New Friends Bar is my favourite. Here you can see what Pattaya is all about
goes: theatre. Comedy. Who thinks that life around the age of fifty is too much
has to offer than playfulness and joking is wrong. And it's such
nice name: new friends are made in the night and they never get old.
New Friends is a circus tent with a raised boxing ring in the middle. Over there
around it there are loose bars, about twelve pieces, each with a dozen girls from
different age. But now we're talking about boxing.
Every twenty minutes the American disco boom turns off and the
Thai war music. It is reminiscent of the Scottish bagpipes, but then
more terrifying. The red lights above the bars go out, the boxing ring turns bright
lit, it's foggy with cigarette smoke, two skinny guys with
boxing gloves stand in the corners praying. I love the authentic
Thai culture, pray first and then beat each other.
With the boxing gloves they protect their face and with the feet they try
touch each other's crotch. They spare each other in the beginning, but the audience whips
them up, and when the first painful blow is delivered, things get serious. The boy
with the yellow pants raises his knee and the boy in blue falls on his back, he
painfully holds his crotch.
The American and European men (especially Germans, but also many Dutch)
can appreciate this. For a moment they forget about the beautifully made-up girls who are their
caress their crotch and whisper in their ear, to cheer loudly for the boy
in yellow. The art of the men is not to go on their backs, the art of the
women is to get on the back as soon as possible.
When the game is over, the disco boom starts again and the girls go into the
dancing merrily. Not every bar is busy. The bars with prettier girls are many
more crowded. That is also so nice about Pattaya. Not only is it settled with
good and evil, one is also honest about beautiful and ugly.
Ugly girls have to do the craziest things for ten dollars, the pretty ones can
afford one customer per night. And they have the right to choose. If
when a more imposing customer comes by, they suddenly stop caressing your crotch and
to whisper in your ear. They drop you like a brick. Older men
can still compete with each other.
The losers among us, the limps, the cares, the men with a skin disease
and the men who stink despite all the perfume leave New Friends without new ones
to have made friends. They stagger into the night, looking for their hotel, and
still there is consolation. Along the boulevard, by midnight, the ghastly are under the
whores lined up. God has taken care of everything. The ugliest girls can
have it done by a true artist for a dollar. He smears
every scar or burn gone. The woman with a swollen belly gets one
tight cloth around it, barely allowing her to breathe, but there's the chance
at five dollars good compensation for it.
At midnight, the battle of the deformed begins in Pattaya: deformed
western men who still want to make a number, deformed eastern ones
women who want to eat the next day. Deep in the night find the ugly
each other. Kipling was so wrong.
Thanks to Douwe Bosma for submitting this article.
Beautiful, beautiful story that captures the atmosphere very, very well.
Thank God I haven't been there for years. But I see it: nothing has changed yet.
One of the better stories on TB
Congrats!
Posting such an article is of course asking for a reaction…
Our famous essayist, poet, columnist, writer, journalist and program maker Anil Ramdas in no more.. (self-murder, to stay in the style of his piece)
His jaw cramps were probably incurable in recent years, from constantly shouting GW…GW….GW….GW….GW.
one evening in Pattaya and our moralist, (sorry world traveller) had to vomit.
Thank goodness I've been coming here for years, and nothing has changed thankfully.
(don't recognize his twist of thought)
1 of the better stories for the NRC…
RIP
Brilliant, I loved Anil Ramdas, his sharp mind and pen, who could so describe Pattaya that Heaven and Hell come alive in it. Thanks Hans Bos for posting this.
Look, that's what I meant Dirk. And indeed I also want to express my thanks for the placement.
(I actually forgot about that at first, so that's why)
The ipiece is 10 years old, with my experiences, it was already the case, in 1980 and now in 2012 it is still the case... but I think everywhere in the 'light' moral neighborhoods, in the past near the Keileweg, in Rotterdam, there were the gentlemen/enthusiasts around in Mercedes. And finally, there is nothing wrong with it, for example if you are married and after a short time, sex often fizzles out. I know many elderly people, fat, thin, handsome and ugly, who have had a fighting marriage for 25 years and more.
I can now enjoy them and the ladies here in this country often look more attractive than in Europe or anywhere else! In the white world it is a well-known fact that in the more expensive sex clubs, dark-skinned girls are the most popular. If I am here as 60+ [incl. fat belly and thin hair] is sitting at a bat, the girl is allowed to look at handsome young people, which makes sense!!!
When I go out once, I also like to 'talk about' with a young girl and know very well that I have a walking ATM. before they are. I know and don't make a fuss about it, I find the temperature, atmosphere and everything I need to live, much more important! and from the looks of it, the writer of the piece was also not a beauty and outside his writer's work , also happy with something between the sheets . And a well-known fact is, with one sip, an even uglier lady becomes a dream princess
But fun to read
Mildly paranoid? The story was sent to us by a reader, judged to be appropriate for TB (which did not exist in 2002) and posted with no ulterior motive. Fortunately, you have already been discovered on TB…
Am not a fan of Pattaya, been there three times and that was enough.
I don't feel comfortable there, don't like the atmosphere, and drinking beer, watching women, and all the other entertainment that is provided in Pattaya is not for me.
What always annoys me is the stereotype that people like this writer deliver about the visitors of Pattaya.
In the two times I visited Pattaya, I have indeed seen many of the gentlemen described, but certainly a larger number of younger men.
No, I don't like men, so it's not him.
But as for the older gentlemen, bulged and mustacheed or not, I can vividly imagine why they do not attempt short-lived or perhaps longer “happiness” in their own country.
Right yes.
Therefore.
Hans Nl. can you help me out of the dream?? At the beginning of your speech you say that you have been 3 times and that was enough, a little further on, about in the middle you say that you have visited Pattaya 2 times, what is it now? just a counting error or something of mood making (howling with the wolves in the woods)
Regards,
Lex K
I always loved reading Anil Ramdas and admired his phenomenal style. That's how I'd like to be able to write, I thought and still think.
But he stole my heart with a comment about interviewing. Anil witnessed how a journalist bombarded an Indian father, whose son had died in the Twin Towers, with questions. As a result, he wrote:
'Questions like: How are you feeling? How many deaths do you regret? Who do you think is to blame for this? I cannot ask such questions. Not out of some pride because these kinds of questions are impertinent and the answers predictable, well no. I wish I could ask them. I simply lack the guts.'
(Source: It's best to live without love, Anil Ramdas)
Wonderful story and apart from the price mentioned in the article, it also applies to today.
It is also easy to deduce inflation from this: 10 dollars for a song is a very big exception today, which is easily triple that amount. Count your profit: from 2002 to 2012 the dollar lost 30% against the Thai baht, but what you pay for a number is 200% more expensive, an “inflation” of an average of 15% per year. Inflation for “normal” living is set at 4% in Thailand. So a number is apparently not in the inflation basket. The men who already deviate a bit from the average have also become crazier in those ten years.
LS,
In my opinion, the piece says more about the late Mr. Ramdas than about Pattaya.
Incidentally, Kipling has rarely been so misinterpreted.
beautifully written , I recently visited pattaya , and can not wait to return .
Lovely piece, I was there in January, I really enjoyed it, unfortunately I have only been going there for a few years, I missed a lot, but I'm catching up, I'll be back in May, I always say Disney World for old men, just a short flight
I had never heard of this good man nor read or seen anything about him. Now that he is dead, that will not happen, because if this column is indicative of his work, then I thank you for it. Must be my sense of humor, but I didn't like this part at all.
The man has apparently been to Pattaya and if the result of that visit was only a column, then that is quite poor. But it is easy to write and also reads well, such a negative story.
Yes, I know, in a column you can lie, exaggerate, fantasize and whatnot, but I don't recognize Pattaya in this at all. Dollars instead of Baht? Come on! Only eat burgers? Don't make me laugh, the choice of restaurants is immense! A club for pedophiles? Did he find one? Deformed men meeting deformed women? What a disgusting comment.
I looked up a picture of the writer and then think again about those after midnight encounters. I'm afraid he must have belonged to that category of deformed men. Such a frustrated story is the logical result.
The story is something to think about. Between the lines you can read the irresistible and repulsive, but in the text the irresistible. What is strongest in us now, everyone will have to decide for themselves. I think holidays remain a time to do other things. A visit to Pattaya is worth a holiday, but it is up to you to decide for yourself how far you want to go. Perhaps the proverb has ; in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king, something to do with it. Judging by the appearance, everyone feels like a king (not meant personally, figuratively)
Sad that he committed suicide. A good journalist with an idiosyncratic sound. His views on Pattaya may be those of a superficial observer, but in any case well worded. Anyone who knows more about this place knows that the reality here is more complex. If only it were true that there are no men under 50 walking around, because indeed the nicer ladies, and rightly so unfortunately, prefer younger men more and risk missing out on all the insight and wisdom of the older ones on the bargain.
That price inflation is correct and indeed difficult to comprehend. The prices here do not differ from those in the Red Light District is my impression and that is strange when you consider that in 1980 I paid almost as many baht for a hotel room as now, while the plane ticket only costs about 75% more than then. I don't think it's because the ladies have become so much more beautiful or show so much more passion. The cause may of course have to do with the increased age, because a young person could well get his money's worth for less. Well, what the heck.
Since Anil Ramdas died on his birthday at the age of 52, as the family announced, a self-inflicted death, the question remains whether it is so sad. A self-chosen death by a man of his stature seems more spiritual than sad to me. We don't know what he was spared by this choice. I'm going to read it again (further).
A nice story, but very black and white. I had also been holidaying in Pattaya for a few years at that time. The hamburger story makes no sense. Most foreigners just ate Thai and so did the story of the 10 dollar bills.
I was never asked to pay with that money. The pedophile story is
also made up. There were no bars with 14 year olds. Perhaps hidden somewhere far away, but a figure who writes an article about Pattaya and has been here for 1 or 2 days has only heard about it.
And then putting all kinds of people down like he does is ridiculous.
I also walked in the Pattaya at that time. It is greatly exaggerated.
Nowadays it is very difficult for a pedophile to get his money's worth in Pattaya. Bars are regularly checked for the age of the ladies.
The punishments for pedophiles are not bad. Perhaps Anil has a Catholic background
and after hearing about all that happened there, the children killed themselves. That's just a theory, but it's possible, right?
Cor.
Ton, I understand your reaction, but I always find death a bit sad (except that of our dear lord who died for us all) and I myself have lived eight years longer than Anil Ramdas has become old. In those eight years I had a lot of fun, especially in Pattaya.
What I wonder is whether the person in the photo has given permission to be posted. I've seen him before (that photo) and mister is always portrayed as a h ** runner while he was probably just looking for the temple in Pattaya.
What about the woman next to that person in the photo? In fact, she is therefore also portrayed as a woman of easy virtue hired by the person in question in the photo, while it may be an 'ordinary' couple.
Not all is as it seems that's true although we all know that Thai women generally will not dress - as much as we like - as in the picture in public.
Even Thai women who have lived in the Netherlands for years, where such clothing is the most normal thing in warm weather (except for some villages such as Staphorst and Urk and certainly not on Sundays) will not take to the streets in the Netherlands.
In that respect, the Thai woman can be called a prude in public, which is of course to be respected.
Again, not everything is what it seems, but with adjoining certainty I dare to say that the photo is not out of place.
If I'm wrong, there may be bars in front of the eyes or else just delete the photo. 😉
Every day I see enough Thai women in these clothes (single, shorts) sitting on the back of a motorcycle or walking on the street. I don't think they're ladies of pleasure, but I'm not sure. They're just plain low class girls I think.
That farang also looks normal to me, not really a sex tourist by the looks of it.
I actually never see prostitutes in Bkk (except around Sukhumvit and famous places). There are also no gogo bars in my habitat. There are only very large drive-in love hotels, but I have never seen a car enter or exit there. So I don't know how these things work. They are very well shielded but very large so something has to happen inside if they are to have a right to exist.
Vabis and Bertus.
Go read the book De Fatale Fuik by Henk Werson.
Who knows, maybe you won't spend the whole day thinking about your pleasures in Thailand because you probably won't be offered anything.
Don't think those girls enjoy you.
In fact, chances are that people like you will ruin her life forever.
Rather help them, then you will be surprised how much gratitude and love you can get in return.
Or do you guys not like bragging to your friends?
What would you think if your own daughter did that, would you proudly put that in the media?
There it starts again, lecturing the others. I would almost become religious, because at least it is made clear in the Bible that he who is without sin may cast the first stone and that you must first remove the beam from your own eye before interfering with the mote in someone else's. What misconduct did Vabis and Bertus display? There are a lot of so-called debauched Pattaya-goers who are extremely friendly with women and a lot of good judges of that who walk around in cheap sweatshop-made T-shirts and wear copy-watches. Always start by looking in the mirror and judging what you find there and if you are sensible leave it at that.
Brad Siam.
I am wise enough not to wave the Bible or the Quran around.
Well with the book De Fatale Fuik.
Take a closer look at that and then ask yourself how it is possible that the sex industry city of Pattaya attracts millions of customers.
The employees do not get there through the employment office .
The few million visitors don't come to walk for l:l with a sticky tattoo and only a cheap T shirt that you get money for elsewhere if you put it on.
Of course there are people who want to come and see if those stories are really true .
They therefore get their money's worth.
Pim, self-confidence is a beautiful quality and the fact that you write that you think you are wise is proof of that. That De Fatale Fuik is your Bible is also fine, because apparently you can swing that book again. I will put an even simpler text from the Bible, which I absolutely do not believe in. Judge not, lest ye be judged.
Prostitution is one of the oldest professions and will not disappear soon, even if you still write such harrowing books about it. It is certain that those who use these services bring a lot of money into Thailand, where wheelchairs, houses and land are bought for the family, among other things. Many girls have those bad guys who send them a nice amount of money every month. Those who have a superior moral judgment about it usually do little to prevent girls from ending up in prostitution. Very few maintain someone in Thailand without providing sexual services in return. Who are you better off with is the question.
A salient detail in this kind of discussion is that it is apparently extra objectionable if you want sex and are also old. Young bucks apparently do less wrong. Being fat and being German are also usually dismissed as bad qualities. Maybe one day we will come to the point where people are seen as equals and that everyone can make their own choices without comment, but then I fear prostitution will disappear from the world even sooner.
Brad Siam.
I stand up for those girls because I personally experienced the most terrible things in that environment.
1 was sent her grandfather's ear because they wanted 60.000 euros from her.
Later she was murdered.
1 girl of 18 was found naked in the street by the police under the influence of voodoo in freezing cold.
She had passed on 31 addresses of people who had to deal with it after she had been treated in an institution.
1 day later she was put on a plane to Africa, 2 days later she was dead.
2 weeks later the one who brought them to me was also missing, after 1 week they found him in the water.
It all started with a friend of mine asking me to hide his girlfriend.
I myself am from NL. left and of course ended up in that circuit again.
My eyes were opened and I was able to help 1 woman and her 2 children with a very good education.
The family is very grateful to me, as a thank you I can now use 39 rai of land from them where we have started a project together in the hope of helping the entire area to work.
Partly because of someone who supports me financially, their future looks bright.
I wish there were people who would take a look at the background of why those boys and girls work in the sex industry.
Because of this I recommend the book De Fatale Fuik so that those who come here especially to use it, think that there are also other ways.
There are other ways to find it if you're short on love.
Give love and you will get much more in return, although that will be difficult for many people.
I would recommend reading: Miss Bangkok, memoirs of a Thai prostitute
It has been discussed on this blog by khun Peter and on my site I have also discussed it (http://www.dickvanderlugt.nl/?page_id=4718).
The only drawback is that the book is not available in the Netherlands, only in Thailand. And maybe the English language puts some off, although I can't imagine that.
Also recommended: Bangkok boy. I recently met this Bangkok boy. He is now 45 years old and works as a manager in a bar in Bangkok. But for this book you also have to go to Asia Books.
Pim, the kind of excesses of the sex industry that you describe are horrible, everyone will agree with you, but it sounds rather un-Thai to me. At least when it comes to the connection between Westerners and Thai girls in the beer bars and the go-go bars. It is precisely the relaxed atmosphere that makes the sex industry here less objectionable in my opinion than in almost the rest of the world. You cannot create the atmosphere that prevails here under duress, whatever you think about it. The girls decide for themselves whether they go to work today or stay at home and bar owners get headaches from their fickleness. Bad things undoubtedly happen in the Thai – Thai or Thai – Burma circuit and I also have my doubts about all those Eastern Bloc girls in the Netherlands and Thailand. I also know from my environment of a Thai in the Netherlands who was recruited and whose family was threatened, although that also ended in a fizzled manner. Thai girls are also lured to Hong Kong and Japan, some under false pretenses. However, especially here in Thailand, things are rarely played very loudly and many girls choose this work on the advice of an aunt or friend or older sister (of which there are usually many) and although it may not be very honorable, I think they like it. know whether they want to do this or work in the fields or in construction, because that is not a party either. I find an unpleasant reason for this work to be pressure from parents, which unfortunately happens more often than is publicized. In my opinion, the biggest threats to the girls here are alcohol addiction and venereal diseases. The bars often want to get girls drunk because this "enhances the atmosphere" and all those breezers and mixed drinks don't help them either. Venereal diseases are also a major risk in Thailand, but also outside this circuit.
All stories based on an article by a certain Anil. Spent a few days in Pattaya. Of course, society in Thailand cannot be compared to ours. Last Friday we saw (as you call it) monkeys in the market again
Pattaya. What surprised me was the number of older couples with older women as well
(Thai women) who were walking around there. Just from Europe or wherever. Still happy with their wife. Also ask yourself that all those Thai women who are now dating a farang are not happy. In my area and also many acquaintances from it
north and north east all have a farang in the family.
The families are very happy with it. It gives them more prosperity and less poverty. We can do little to change the fact that exploitation and corruption take place in this country. That children are also the victims of it is not.
They prefer a somewhat older farang than a Thai who is drunk every day and who also abuses them and does not pay a penny.
Recently this. Shouldn't we in the Netherlands be ashamed of what happened there.
You can no longer safely take your children to a shelter. There are hundreds of cases
of child abuse. Then just ask any man or woman. Are you going to Thailand?
Isn't that the country where all those pedophiles go?
The only answer you can give is. Here they just get 36 years in prison.
And not the same as in the Netherlands after 3 years back on the street. And if you like the Catholic
church, it must be out of date.
Cor.
In Muay Thai much is allowed, but hitting each other in a certain place or in the crotch, kicking or the so-called 'knee' is not allowed as far as I know.
Pattaya and prostitution.
What a rewarding subject.
Have these people ever heard of Amsterdam?
I've been coming to Pattaya for years and Pattaya is more than prostitution
You are absolutely right that Pattaya is more than prostitution and that it also occurs in Amsterdam, no one will want to dispute that and it is also nice that you take it up for Pattaya, but to compare both places I think we are talking about the famous apples and pears.
SirCharles.
Did you mean that there are more apples to admire in one street in Pattaya than in all of Amsterdam?
I meant that Pattaya is the largest (open-air) brothel in Southeast Asia, not comparable to Amsterdam.
Now that we are talking about apples and pears, I think that in one street in Pattaya there are indeed more beautiful pears to admire than in the whole of Amsterdam because women are metaphorically referred to as having the shape of a pear because of their curves of hips and buttocks. on the other hand, the man is referred to as being an apple because of the size of that well-known body part around the navel, which I do not admire but only observe. 😉
SirCharles,
There are also whores in Amsterdam.
The whore-runners… who travel to Pattaya don't just go for sex. Sex you can
if you add everything together much cheaper in AMS. It starts with. A. plane
ticket. B.Hotel. Just for these 2 things you can have much more sex in the Netherlands
in those 3 or 4 weeks of vacation in Thailand. All men, and I'm very sure, go first and foremost for fun. What could be better than with a clean Thai at the bar
to sit and have a drink? What could be better than spending 4 weeks with a Thai beauty? Because the hookers here in Pattaya stay with you if you at least take good care of them
The angry outside world thinks ”oooooo”' so bad about male Thailand visitors but they
judging with ””prejudice””
In other words, there is so much more to Pattaya than just what I already confirmed in response to Thijs Keizer, thank you for your reconfirmation. 🙂
If you prefer to go out with another lady, it can sometimes happen that the lady you have been so good to suddenly turns out to be a wild cat.
But enough about the ladies.
It is also a great adventure on a jet ski, always waiting to see how much damage you have made again.
You have to be in Pattaya for that because they don't have it in Amsterdam.