As a tourist visitor, you will hopefully not have to deal with the Dutch embassy, because in most cases that would involve nasty circumstances in which you would call in the (consular) help of the embassy.
However, if you are staying in Thailand for a longer period of time or even permanently, you must have visited the beautifully situated Dutch Embassy between Wireless Road and Soi Ton Son in the Pathumwan district of Bangkok. It may be for obtaining a new passport or another consular service or simply for attending King's Day celebrations, for example.
As mentioned, the embassy has an excellent location, a large garden, indeed stretching from Wireless Road to Soi Ton Son, with a large modern office building and a residence in a historic building next to it. In the office building, the “daily” work is carried out by the ambassador and his staff of associates, while the residence is often used for cultural events and reception of important guests. The garden is also frequently used for events, such as the celebration of King's Day, Remembrance Day, Sinterklaas, etc.
However, having arguably the nicest embassy complex in Bangkok costs money, probably a lot of money. Many embassies in Bangkok have their offices in large office buildings in the center and it is thought that housing could become a lot cheaper as a result.
I come to this subject because there is talk of the closure of the English embassy, because the land could be sold for the construction of a hotel or office building. That also beautiful Embassy of the United Kingdom is located on Wireless Road north of Ploenchit Road and has also been located there for many decades. About 6 years ago, part of the site was sold to a project developer and rumors are that the rest of the land would also be sold.
Great consternation in the English community, who think it's a bad thing, because the service and prestige of the embassy are considered important. A response to Thaivisa reads as follows:
“Having a number of offices in one building, forcing the ambassador to rent space in a hotel for certain events or visits from guests, is quite embarrassing. A good ambassador will spend a lot of time practicing quiet diplomacy on all fronts and building relationships that can lead to business success in the future. The results are difficult to measure, but the result will certainly cover the costs. Thailand is probably primarily a trade-oriented post rather than a political one. Closing the embassy would therefore be very short-sighted.”
The Netherlands is also restructuring the foreign service, read cutbacks! Dutch embassies and consulates elsewhere in the world are already being closed and staff are also being cut back. It would be logical that the embassy of the Netherlands in Bangkok would be budget cut, but I think that the word short-sighted is also appropriate here.
I do not believe that there are currently any plans or ideas at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in The Hague to close the embassy in Bangkok in an "English way", but in advance I think that the current location should be maintained under all circumstances. The Dutch embassy in Bangkok is the calling card of the Netherlands, which should rather spend more money than suffer from cutbacks.
The statement is therefore: The Dutch Embassy must remain where it is now! Leave your opinion in a comment to the readers of Thailandblog.
So we are asked to respond to something that is not up for discussion as it is not apparently in the offing as it is with the English Embassy (GB). Why should I worry about a non-existent problem? The answer is clear anyway; That people will generally want some kind of representation in the neighborhood. Convenience serves people.
The aerial view is nice and the garden must be very beautiful. but when I come for a passport, I get no further than the single entrance gate and a dingy office with some poor counters, compared to which my old post office in the Netherlands was a palace.
I won't get any further than this poor thing, because I don't take the plane from Koh Samui to shake hands with the ambassador in the garden during Sinterklaas.
To maintain all this costly hassle for a few parties such as King's Day and (yes, yes) the Sinterklaas party and a few "important guests" I think is terribly exaggerated.
Other countries, larger international players than the Netherlands and with considerably more trade interests, can function in rented office space. So the Dutch embassy should be able to do that without any problems.
I don't see any problem in moving to an office tower and a rented hall for Sint and Piet.
With such savings on accommodation costs, Dutch may be spoken at the counter again in the future.
I am of the opinion that the Dutch Embassy should remain where it is now. It would be better to cut the (counter) payments to the ladies and gentlemen of the EU in Brussels and it would be even better to close down the entire EU business in Brussels, that would only yield enormous savings.
I don't quite understand what Brussels has to do with this. That's a bit like "why are we paying X million to a referendum/asylum seekers/.. while the old people/health care costs/... get screwed". But maybe Brussels is a good example that you should not only look at the cost picture, but at the bigger picture. Also the embassy, looking purely at the costs and not the (in) direct benefits and other costs / benefits would be short-sighted. For example, we have been a net payer in Brussels for many years, but we have a lot of additional income (and expenses). It will be the same with the embassy.
https://www.europa-nu.nl/id/vh7zbu35kazc/europa_kosten_en_baten
It is better that the Dutch Embassy stays where it is now
Mr. Hartogh also represents the interests of Dutch entrepreneurs there
so it means additionally pushing the Dutch economy to a high level
fully agree that our embassy should remain on the site where it is now located.
Naturally, the Embassy must remain as it is now.
It is the calling card of the Netherlands.
Hendrik-Jan
Dear editors; I also think it would be a shame if the embassy had to close. I doubt whether a “handful of Dutch people” in Thailand can exert pressure on this government. After all, they don't listen to the Dutch in the Netherlands itself! But not shooting is always wrong. I want to leave it at that.
It is a proposition with many considerations and possibilities. Difficult for me.
I assume that several people have already thought about this before.
I come from the “advertising” world and I think I know how important it is to show a “business card”. Very important. Especially if you are a business-oriented Dutch embassy.
As I always try to make it clear to my staff that we do sell a product, but all the more a brand name. Promoting a brand name well and advertising it really costs a lot of money. And just like with the embassy in this case, it is impossible to calculate what the long-term consequences will be if you stop doing so.
Very soon what it will save. And that is often decisive if you have to cut costs.
Not always smart, but often necessary.
Completely gone in that place after all these years would be a failure compared to the “business world”. So they have no more money. …they have to cut costs. That's always bad.
On the other hand, the outdoor activities are also important for both the Dutch community itself and the people we would like to do “business” with.
Like recently the film festival where mainly Thai visitors came and various other activities such as Orange factory etc. etc. The other foreign ambassadors who come to visit and the silent diplomacy of which we know little or nothing. Of course also the commemoration of the dead and the coming King's Day ... but you can't make money with that if I may say so.
But everything and everyone has to cut costs.
Things are going badly in the Netherlands and that is where a large part of the money has to come from.
If you look at the land prices in Bangkok, the land of the embassy alone is worth gold and sales should certainly be considered.
As an SME man, I would now opt for the golden mean.
Sell, like the English, part of the land.
You still have all the advantages such as good location, visitor's card and garden.
Only it's a bit smaller.
Of course a good architect looks at which piece of land you are selling. By doing it carefully, many people do not notice it and there is little damage in that respect.
Even selling a small piece is enough to keep the "tent" running for a while.
The Hague will therefore intervene less quickly and take decisions that, in our opinion, go too far.
Given “the love” for the Netherlands, which is evident from most contributions from farangs on this forum, I would think it would be better to close the embassy.
Sell those expensive buildings and land and find a cheap apartment from which the eternally grumbling farang can be served.
The embassy is there primarily to represent the interests of BV Nederland.
In other words, commercial interests.
Secondary, I think, is issuing visas to stakeholders, including Thai.
Tertiary is serving the Dutch, so certainly not "farang", which for many of us has a loaded content similar to the word nigger and jew, for example. i
It is more about efficiency, it would be better to open more satellites in Thailand to trade there. Simple offices which are open at certain times.
If you live in eg Konkhaen, then you have to go all the way to BK.
Soestdijk Palace is now also simply sold, while this always gave off a certain image.
However, the entire Binnenhof will now be overhauled for renovation, which will cost hundreds of millions.
Also applies here now, when you have money you can even place a house in a nature area.
King Willem needed a temporary workplace, budget 300000 euros, but you have to increase it by a factor of 3. They are not very good at budgets. The house to be occupied by the royal couple is estimated at 650 million, so actually...!
In any case, the government will always throw money around, depending on the state of affairs.
Too bad perhaps for BK embassy.
I also understood that you have to speak English or Thai to be helped?!?
I think it is nonsense to celebrate Sinterklaas, King's Day, etc. on the embassy grounds and that is not what an embassy is intended for in my opinion.
So if they move for economic reasons, I think it goes without saying… Too bad for the partygoers.
Fred
Completely agree with maintaining the current embassy location! The Netherlands has a centuries-old relationship with Thailand and historical awareness plays a relevant role here. So many striking historical buildings have already disappeared in BKK that preservation of – at least – the residence is desirable from that point of view. Don't let people fall into the mistake that was made in Vietnam: closing the embassy, leaving a beautiful villa (which was quickly taken over by the Belgians!) And after 8 years, reconsideration followed with a much more expensive establishment, first in a hotel and now in an impersonal compound… …
Embassy should stay there, nice quiet point, good for our business image.
Good point also for the often somewhat elderly Dutch people who stay here and for problems. You can go here in a decent, quiet place and also in your own language.
If cuts really have to be made, cooperation in this area with another Western country would be preferable to a busy impersonal office building.
Personally, I don't care at all whether the embassy stays where it is now, or is housed elsewhere.
But why not merge the Dutch embassy and an embassy of, for example, the UK.
There was room on the site to build another office building and use the residence together, for example.
Everyone happy.
I have been to the Embassy several times for some formalities, I think we can be proud of this beautiful building. It is a calling card for the Netherlands, for me they can keep it.
Hi, I don't care where they are as long as I get a new passport or income statement etc
can pick up in bangkok that is the most important for me.
greetings Pekasu
Times are changing, they all have to work together the EU countries, a large building where several countries have their consular offices, and open from 09.00:17.00 to XNUMX:XNUMX, Monday to Friday, ... we are an EU country so that would be very convenient … the sentiment that this is a beautiful building..I agree..but you hardly ever visit it, this still counts heavily to sell it, use the money to make a permanent consular section in Phom-Penh, and one in Myamar along with others member states.
What an effort to debate this, it doesn't pay. We are not about it, have no influence and when it comes up it will continue as “The Hague” thinks.
Personally, I think that the Netherlands should definitely keep its embassy in Bangkok and certainly in a country
like thailand. Many embassies are going to live in a much smaller housing to save money and that is not good for the future. Certainly the embassy of the Netherlands in Bangkok gives a good feeling as far as the reputation of the Netherlands is concerned, and I think that in the future it will give the Netherlands more perspective in all kinds of areas. Sincerely, Frederik D Stoelwinder.
They would be better off moving it outside the city, it is very difficult to reach now.
And you can no longer go there for a visa.
“And you can no longer go there for a visa”
That is incorrect, one now has the choice between handing in the papers at the embassy or visiting the VAC (Trendy building) of VFS Global. If you don't want to use VFS, you can.
What is strange: the same rate is charged regardless of whether you as an applicant visit the embassy or the external service provider. Outsourcing naturally means (higher) costs, which in this case are passed on to the customer. The idea behind it is probably that:
1) is easier with 1 tariff.
2) Otherwise people prefer to go to the embassy, which must (usually, barring unforeseen force majeure of course) offer an appointment within 2 weeks. If you start the application on time, it is best to wait a maximum of 2 weeks for an appointment and the option for "cheap" submission to the embassy itself will of course be more attractive. Especially since the front office staff has years of experience there.
NB: the English also apply for English passports via VFS, I understood via ThaiVisa. I won't be surprised if other tasks will also go to VFS in due course. In this way, the Netherlands could also make further cutbacks if they copied the British and passed on the (additional) costs to the citizen. Let's hope that won't happen anytime soon.
Just keep. we Dutch are not good with changes in the end it always costs more.
Of course, the location of the embassy is a nice calling card, but you could make it smaller and cheaper elsewhere with a similar appearance. The work at the embassy is not only about promoting the trade interests of the Netherlands, for example, but is also about providing service to the Dutch and I think this could also be arranged differently. For everything and anything you have to go to Bangkok, why not have an embassy that is smaller but also set up consular agents/offices in various places in Thailand where you can, for example, apply for your passport or visa for your partner. These agents are also the ears and auxiliary troops of the embassy.
In November 2014, my Thai wife and I had a nice tour by Mrs Deveci at the office and garden of the embassy. It's just a beautiful place, an oasis of peace and beauty in the middle of BKK. I also talked to Mrs Deveci at the time that with the cutbacks in foreign posts and hopefully there would never be a sale of the residence. Renting some offices somewhere 30 high behind some offices is cheaper, but you shouldn't just look at money. Also think about the business card, history, what is pragmatic, etc. Now I don't know about the current costs, but if you are going to rent something somewhere, the question is what the prices will do. Cheap can turn out to be expensive in the long term, or moving to a cheap place every so many years...
No, I would think it a shame if it came to sale. If that budget is no longer there, the financial situation at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs must be very sad.
Presenting a neat business card by means of a good location and beautiful building: completely agree.
But as the Dutch say: you can dance, even if not with the bride.
Very expensive location, moreover in the middle of the city so not exactly easy to reach for many.
Why not check out a neat, well-connected suburb. And why not house it in a representative tower block together with other organisations?
Yes, a beautiful garden indeed. But inside it is often spinning around like herrings in a barrel for the normal visitor; and it seems to me that the visitors are more important than the plants. Nice if you are a VIP and get VIP treatment; then you have nothing to worry about. But most visitors are “normal” people.
We should be able to show the rest of the world that we can present ourselves neatly, hospitably and cost-consciously. I also think it would be a nice signal to Dutch taxpayers, who have had to give up for years.
Moreover, it is also easy to reach by metro if you do not want to use other transport. Even the road to the embassy is beautifully designed
I think I read somewhere that the plot where the embassy is now located is a gift from the Thai king to the Dutch royal family..
If so (?) then definitely NOT expired. This would mean a huge loss of face.
Please make an adjustment: make parking for us Dutch visitors, because parking in that area is a disaster.
Yours faithfully,
Climb.
It is of course quite likely that the land in Bangkok, where the price per cm2 is now used in the city center, will yield a nice penny. 100 million will not be a strange price for that large piece and knowing the Dutch, they have little hesitation to cash in on that piece of land donated by the Thai King. Incidentally, the piece is large enough to create more spacious parking and to build a nice accommodation for the high-ranking guests. As a Dutch Government I would be ashamed to sell it, but that's just the way they are here...
At its current location, the embassy can hardly be reached by car. If I have to go to the embassy, I have to take the minibus, the BTS and the motorcycle taxi. For consular services, the embassy would be better moved to the outskirts of Bangkok, such as along the Rama II highway, so that I can also get there by car. Wasn't the embassy for providing services to Dutch citizens?
Shut down that expensive location immediately.
You can also look after trade interests from other cheaper locations, for example on the outskirts of the city, most of which is done by computer these days.
Silent diplomacy is also possible from, for example, a temporarily rented room in a hotel. Parties and commemorations ditto.
If you still want to keep it in the neighborhood or in the building itself, make sure that there is also parking space at the new embassy building, so that visitors (John with the cap or an expensive diplomat) can at least park his/her car, because the accessibility of the current building isn't really anything to write home about. Moreover, whether you go by private transport or by taxi, you are always stuck, especially in that part of Bangkok.
So outside the city is not so crazy, cheaper, more accessible, possibly even larger park to which a number of people are apparently attached.
It is of course a beautiful building and also a business card, but let them sell that large garden and parking lot and then use that money to employ staff who also speak Dutch and that large garden is also only there for show because the few people those who happen to arrive with their own car may walk a kilometer to lose their car while the embassy parking lot is empty.
YES I hope it stays where it is now as it is close to swiss nai lert park hotel where I often stay and it is so close.
As far as I'm concerned, the Ned. embassy moved to Pattaya. Since 90% of the farang live there and it is a much nicer and cleaner city than Bangkok, Pattaya is ideal for the farang embassies. Doing business in the morning (applying for a visa for your wife, etc.) and then a cold beer in Soi Buakhao. In the evening, finally, enjoy the agogos, surely much nicer than that boring neighborhood in Bangkok where no dogs come?
Pattaya is booming and condos are popping up at a rapid pace. A matter of about 20 years before that filthy Bangkok is also replaced as the capital by Pattaya. Why not bring the embassies here now?
Of course, our embassy in Bangkok should remain where they have been for so long. The piece of land and the buildings are owned by the Dutch state. No rent or tax is paid. All the extra costs are the wages of a couple of gardeners. The location is beautiful and central and very easily accessible. And the longer it remains in possession, the higher its value. The only thing that would be good would be to make more parking space for visitors. The garden is big enough and I don't think the ambassador and his family really need all that space.
Regards!!
Selling for big money and moving to a more accessible place does not have to be in Bankok, but nearby, and parties do not have to be held as far as I am concerned, after all, this is done in almost every city or large village anyway
The current place is really a very expensive place and will yield min. 200 million baht, something else can certainly be built for that.
such a large site, but there is no disabled parking space, scandalous
A number of functions have already been removed from the embassy.
In particular the visa for Thai to the Netherlands.
These are housed at vfs.
King's Day etc can very well be held in other places.
Of course an embassy is needed.
However, with the function for the average, this can also be done very well from a less luxurious entourage.
In terms of appearance, it is not necessary that we use such an expensive place while the actions are cut back.
So less cost is possible in this case.
sell the lot and open a normal business office in a normal area that is easily accessible. if possible, even open a regional office, which is open, for example, once a week.
don't see any advantage in those gaudy expensive status buildings. that is from colonial times
It is better that the Dutch Embassy stays where it is now
Mr. Hartogh also represents the interests of Dutch entrepreneurs there
so it means additionally pushing the Dutch economy to a high level