Statement of the week: 'Foreigners should not criticize Thai society'

You live as a foreigner in Thailand. Of course there are always people who are only positive about Thai society and people who are negative.
There is also such a thing as what's in between.
If you live in Thailand and you spend your money in that country, like, you buy a house and its contents. You buy a car. You go shopping every day. You pay much more than a Thai for everything. You still support a large part of that Thai's family.
In many cases you also get a lot in return.
You may also criticize that society a bit.
It is not the same as a refugee who comes to one of the European countries
with a suitcase with two pairs of underpants and then embark on a disassembly
for example The Hague for the bad treatment he received because his breakfast was not the same as in his home country.
J. Jordan.

Wonder what can I do against corruption? What can I do against the recently described
situations in prisons? It has been known for years, and for years, also by tourists
they come. Also with the Dutch, and many other nationalities who have retired here
it is generally known.
On the statement “'Foreigners should not criticize Thai society, I say
yes, they can. But not always in the same way, and remember that about our society as well
still 1 and the other is missing

You can certainly take criticism, but you should bear in mind that our form of criticism is often too direct. Last experience with someone who grumbled and cursed about the way of driving in Thailand. Who has priority or not? Where is the system? If you drive your moped or bicycle along the side of the Pethkasem Road, you should be able to expect oncoming traffic, or people who have a chat in the middle of the side of the street. You can expect a lot that you have to watch out for, but you shouldn't think that you have the right of way or on an empty road… Here you are overtaken from the left, right and front… that's just how it is and you have to live with that .
Also with the way of building, you see that you don't get very far with Western standards, or at least you can get frustrated. So I leave these at home as much as possible…
It is better not to criticize too harshly on politics and religion, because I don't think the Thais do that either.
I know that from Brazil. There the Brazilians can grumble about their country as much as they want and they have a lot of criticism… but don't come as a foreigner… Then suddenly everything is great again…
I feel like it's kind of here too.
From what I have seen so far (besides the political or economic situation) criticism of the daily life of a Westerner is usually very one-sided… his Western mentality against the Thai… I have been to many Asian countries and I like it in Thailand still great.

If safety is at stake or the preservation of our earth, which we borrow from our children, you can show that we in the west are a lot wiser due to the damage and shame of the past.
too bad the thai you can learn something is extremely scarce, like so many good things in life. Despite the motto never give up, I now leave the learning to others.

And since the influences of the West, you can see that their working methods are gradually being copied at parts of multinationals such as Tesco and Big C.
in low-wage countries, people do not find it a problem to spend many man/woman hours every day cleaning up mess.

Of course one may criticize Thai affairs.

The only question is how and where you give that criticism. And some things, such as the royal family and religion, are of course taboo.

First of all, the Dutch are simply pedigree whiners by nature. Really everyone with some experience abroad feels that way. A logical consequence of our VOC culture and development as a fast trading nation. Just like other people from other cultures also have their characteristics. There is nothing wrong with that, but it is wise to just accept this fact and to bend (like bamboo) with another culture such as the Thai when expressing criticism.

The Thai people in particular are really stunned by the, in their eyes, absolutely impermissible direct manner of unsalted criticism, complete with 'the finger', as the Dutchman so incredibly clumsily and truly rudely want to deposit it.

Secondly, the Thai is definitely not as open and multicultural as the Dutch, who, even against their better judgement, let everything happen to them and also invites discussion about trivialities. And in addition, parts of the underdeveloped world have admitted in a way that even begins to (re) reform the national character of the Netherlands. The Thai is proud of its country, which has never been colonized and they say more or less openly that you are welcome to enjoy their beautiful nature, beaches, climate and people, but don't complain about it. And if you want to work here or want to take advantage of the benefits that Thailand (still) offers, that's fine. As long as you don't interfere with their internal affairs, their culture and even they are not served with any help with their problems.

With the latter, almost the entire Thailand blog will be tilted, because the examples of acceptance of aid (read money) are now an ingrained fact in the Thai genes. But that kind of "help" is in other chapters that are often written here and does not concern matters that fall under "criticism." So do not think that in addition to accepting help (money) one will also accept foreign advice.

And this last sentence is of course what makes us so 'angry'. Do lend a hand – Do buy a house and lease land – Do invest – Do boost tourism. But don't criticize it.

Well… So be it. We think it is right to criticize and the Thai does not think so.

Unfortunately, this cultural expression has been instilled in us since childhood. So even if the conclusion were that we as Dutch people are 'right', that is still not important. In the Netherlands people indeed deal with this very differently. Although a Thai will not do that, in the Netherlands he or she will still be allowed to criticize (although?), people will be happy to start the discussion (or be ridiculed) and if they succeed, a committee, a steering group or other democratic monstrosity can get over it. formation, then it is also possible that a Dutch person will listen to that Thai.

I have lived and worked in Thailand for a long time and I am regularly very angry, but hide it because I cannot express a clear opinion and criticism against a Thai. Just knowing that if I did, it would have the opposite effect. What can be done is to bend criticism as much as possible into a positive approach, and use more of those kinds of tricks - sometimes in combination - to make things run differently, better, more efficiently, or cheaper.

Maybe it's better to do it like the Chinese. It is not said that the narrow-gauge railway in Thailand is a huge bottleneck for the high-speed trains from Singapore to Beijing, Shianghai and Delhi. The Thais are simply given such a railway line and know how to get a huge return from it with the characteristic Chinese commercial spirit. No criticism, just smart execution.

Thailand does not change at all in terms of education, corruption and things like this and the farmer plows on…

Regards,

Wim van der Vloet

I enjoy living here, but you always like points of criticism. I also have a look at Dutch society.
You have to take the country as it is. Sabai; sabai.

Of course one should be able to have an opinion about Thai society, it is something else when that opinion is pretended to be the truth, especially when that well-known pedantic finger is also raised, which we Dutch can be quite adept at...

With due observance of the standards of decency, one may still find something about it on any random subject - including Thailand - or have an opinion about it, either about the positive or negative aspects, otherwise blogs and forums would have no right to exist, all daily and weekly newspapers should be shut down and current affairs/talk programs on radio and TV should also disappear.

It is also by no means the intention to want to change things just like that when there is an opinion about something, according to many counterarguments 'yes, but we can't change that anyway, the country belongs to the Thai, we are guests here or we do that they have been saying such and more similar cries for centuries.
In that line, we should not criticize Thailand (read: have an opinion 😉 ) that people from the Isan are disadvantaged because of their skin color, the many environmentally unfriendly plastic bags, the abuse of elephants to teach them tricks, the many stray dogs , corruption and that Thai music that doesn't appeal to me.
Oh well, just a few examples from Thai society that I am not so concerned about, but I do have my reservations and an opinion about it.

And of course I also have an opinion about positive aspects of Thai society, such as the delicious food, the opening hours of shops and, last but not least, my beloved who is part of that same society.

Improving the world, yes, as long as we have the internet and use less nonsense on Facebook, everything will be fine and the poor countries are becoming increasingly aware that things can be done differently, including in Thailand, and then we will be less likely to be at the front among each other and grow towards each other in a friendly manner. Have a nice day and a positive 2013 with lots of positive blogs and emails.
Regards Peter Fly

You can have an opinion, and then it is only to be hoped that it is well-founded, but are you also civilized in expressing it? In the Netherlands it is said that you are at least allowed to express your opinion. That is beautiful. Less nice is that if people notice that you not only say something, but also mean it, you can be charged dearly (in the social field). Speaking is free there, not thinking. Tell me what. It's not for nothing that I left the Netherlands. And don't hope for nothing to never see that country again.
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Am I now going to behave towards the Thais as the Dutch sometimes do towards each other and as the Dutch often - with their interference and their prejudices and their resulting incomprehension - did towards me?
Things are much quieter here in Thailand, I can study better here, I never have to wear a coat when I go outside, I can enjoy the nearby beach much more, I found a suitable place to live much easier here than in the Netherlands.
It is much easier for me to talk to a Thai on the street or on the beach than in the Netherlands with a Dutch person. All this summed up in one word: I am more free here.
And I was going to criticize? And do you think that is allowed? And think I can raise my pedantic index finger? Even if I haven't thought yet? And I should feel that I have a right to an attentive hearing? And that I see everything better than the Thais see it themselves? The latter can only be very partially (and I don't think easily) true. And a partial truth is a distorted truth. On which you cannot build an opinion, let alone advice or teaching.
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On the one hand, I come across a lot here in Thailand, which compares very favorably with what I have encountered in the Netherlands. On the other hand, I sometimes think: that this is not possible or not the case here, that is strange (and sometimes disappointing). Or - more often - that this is possible here, that is remarkable (and often gratifying).
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I also sometimes think: that the Thais have not thrown out those farangs long ago is a miracle. The Dutch in particular, in their own country as well as here, often behave in an alien-hostile manner (forgetting that in Thailand it is not the Thais who are the foreigners, but themselves). The Thais have just that xenophobia, it seems never and never. Up to, I'm afraid, a certain but unexpected limit.
After all, we are guests here. That status obliges good behavior. All the more so because the Thais are very good hosts with their warmth. Who don't bother us with their political or whatever difficulties, do they? At least not me. When I am a guest somewhere, I do not interfere with the household of my host and hostess. And they don't ask me to do that either. Moreover, not everything is going well in the Netherlands' own political economy.
It happened on this blog that a Thai - he was certainly not unworldly - gave his opinion especially about the searching farang they love here. For the most part, the response was insulted. Just the way people, Western people anyway, do who hear an unpleasant truth about themselves. But precisely those people, in my opinion, should not just say something about someone else for lack of objectivity. An (evil) assumption is more easily thought, and more easily spoken than verified.
And then there is the false and rude argument: I'm paying for it, right? Yes, you cannot live here and buy your sandwich in the Netherlands at the same time. But you pay for that sandwich (or for whatever food and for your living, etc., etc.) much less than in the Netherlands. And you don't give up any rights for that, at least not so that you get into trouble.
Anyway, I will undoubtedly get a whole horde of Dutch farangs over me now, because I am infringing on their groupthink, on their I-may-say-whatever-comes-to-me mentality. Just as was often the case when I was still in the Netherlands (but then and there I met my opponents physically, here only on a blog). In all that I may and may not, I may retain my insight and distance myself from the group-think and the habits of the group of which I may categorically belong, but am not an average representative of it.

Dear editor,

with great pleasure I read Thaiand blog. I love reading all those interesting facts and the propositions that are posited. Every now and then I respond myself.

I would suggest that you continue to post commenters' opinions, provided they do not exceed standards of decency. However, what I would highly recommend is NOT to post comments to the commenters in the future. Not because it wouldn't be worth knowing the opinions of others, but more because some commenters don't know the standards of morality and decency.

Unfortunately, there are a number of people who apparently have problems putting themselves in the shoes of others. They are poor in spirit, not brought up properly or do not know what it means to have their own way of thinking.

Let's stay clear of the nonsensical rhetoric of these individuals.

Yes, as a Belgian, I can certainly criticize everything that goes on in the Thai country from abroad, even if the Thai can read that, the world is not Thailand and Thailand is not the world. In Thailand itself as a foreigner yes then it is best to keep your mouth shut about their country and problems, but here I say what I want about their country and their.