Why do I often hear foreigners use broken English against Thais? Do they really think that Thais understand that better than proper English? I find that practice strange and humiliating. Just speak good English! That's not so difficult, is it?
'I don't like' , 'You go where?' 'Give me towel!', 'Food no good', these are just a few examples of how I often hear foreigners communicating with Thais. I hear this mainly from foreigners who have lived here for a long time; they also do that a lot with their partners. I notice that tourists do that less often. I even know Dutch people who use baby English with their Thai partner, while that partner answers in proper English.
You can also see in quotes from the writers on the blog that they almost always talk to a Thai in broken English. Examples galore. Recently: 'You take shower first?' of the foreigner. Correct answer from the Thai: 'We can shower together.'
Do those people really think that Thai 'I don't like it', 'Where are you going?' 'Please give me a towel' or 'This is really bad food', 'Do you want to take a shower first?' do not understand? And then complain that Thais don't speak good English!
I found out after a year that my Thai ex spoke to me in a kind of simplified Thai, and I was furious.
I find this practice extremely humiliating. What you're actually saying is that those Thais are too stupid to learn English properly.
What do blog readers think about this? Do you also speak broken English with a Thai and why? Do you see that as normal, necessary and right or as easygoing, stupid and humiliating?
Of course it is even better to learn Thai, but if you do use English, do so in normal grammatical English. That's my view.
Respond to the statement: 'You shouldn't use broken but correct English when talking to a Thai!'
Good morning from chiang mai,
Yes of course you are right. Talking normal English would be better.
I don't see it as humiliating myself
I also speak in Dutch with my friends because experience has taught me that I am better understood.
How many times has it happened to me that a friend or friend of a friend of mine tried to explain something in the correct English and then the other half, who they often live with for years, asks me.
,, what does he say Carlo,,
Tiny.
I speak coal English. Just enough to have a simple discussion. My wife speaks the same (coal English). We understand each other perfectly. The examples cited by you, that the partner answers in correct English and the husband continues to speak in baby English… well that is a sign, at least for me, that they cannot do otherwise. By the way, language between two people is not important at all. If both speak perfect Thai or English with each other. WANTING to understand each other that is important.
Dear Tino, I have yet to meet the first Thai who speaks perfect English, and I'm not talking about Thais who have studied or grew up in England or the US.
I have the same experience as Carlo, Tenglish is understood, normal English is not. You must have a lot of patience and discipline to maintain correct English. Nevertheless, you are right, to learn English speaking Tenglish to each other is not the right way.
Dear Khan Peter,
I'm not talking about perfect English or complicated English. And I'm not talking about the Thai. I maintain that a simple message like 'I don't like it' is understood just as well as 'I don't like'.
Maybe the Thai teachers should also start speaking broken, ungrammatical English to their students because otherwise they won't understand?
Speak pretty good English myself, so I can go with you somewhat Tino, but to call it humiliating is going a step too far. Let's not approach it so difficult and see the humor in it and yes that's why I often make myself 'guilty' of it.
Just like the double verbs that are often used, for example 'walkwalk' and 'looklook' are completely wrong but no less funny, it's not that bad, make that the cat wise! 😉
Dear Tina,
I normally speak Oxford English, but in practice here in Thailand mostly Tenglish, the Lingua Franca here, like Pidgin it is in the South Seas Islands. This is not humiliating, but rather promotes normal communication. Incidentally, my wife is now (after 7 years of marriage) so far that I can speak fairly normal English with her without it causing too much misunderstanding. However, if I speak to an Englishman, Australian or American, my wife usually cannot follow us completely, and I have to translate his English into Tenglish.
So it's about communication, nothing else. In my eyes it has nothing to do with being humiliated or inferior.
@ Jasper I agree with your comment, but would like to make one comment. Tenglish is not a language, not even a dialect, but crooked English.
Pidgin, on the other hand, is considered a language because it has its own grammar, vocabulary, and idiom. It is also spoken on the west coast of Africa. There it is also called Wescos. It has very nice sayings. When I volunteered in Western Cameroon, it could speak a very little bit.
Tenglish is not crooked English. It is a direct translation from Thai. If you speak a little Thai you can speak Tenglish. “pai hongnaam / go toilet.” “mai mee / no have” etc.
Great for communicating with the Thais. Don't forget to add "hood".
@ john van de weg Tenglish is English using Thai grammatical constructions. It's not proper English, so it's crooked English. This is not to say that its use in a conversation is not recommended. If the other person only understands Tenglish, it is wise to use it. After all, language is communication.
Oxford English sounds shitty, BBC English is much more neutral. Do you really mean it when you say this about yourself? Where did you get that? 🙂
hi jasper,
I also have a regular Thai partner from Isaan (Ban Dung) for 2 years and can match your story!!!!
I've been trying to get her to pronounce the R correctly for 2 years now!!!
often does this with phrases such as:
Hairy Harry Fingering Likes Coarse in the Gray Sand!!!!
she has now memorized it, but pronounces it very quickly and unfortunately the R is still an L!!!
just like the word Falang!!
just keep speaking Tengli works best.
Pronouncing the R seems to be a bit inhibited because it is considered a barbaric sound.
I do not know that. My wife pronounces dark as dragon and we made a game out of that.
When I mean dark I say drak and then my wife corrects me with a radiant DARK.
If some words are a bit difficult I put her hand on my larynx so she can feel the vibrations of the pronunciation. To be able to practice it later on yourself.
To practice with the R, I have her say RAM RAM RAM RAM RAM RAM in quick succession.
And because that's fun, she's getting better and better.
Greetings,
Climb.
A statement that you cannot do anything with, fun to read, but that's about it.
The entire world communicates in a way to be understood by the other party. This can be done with hands and feet, gestures, in a language and in a broken language.
What matters is that you are mutually understood. In doing business this is of course a different story, but perfectionism is not for everyone.
I lived on the German border for years, where we spoke the German/Groningen dialect. Cases etc. were not decisive for the communication to be understood.
And as it was recently reported in the media, Mr Louis van Gaal also spoke in his coal English way and he was not blamed for this.
Conversely, we usually adapt to the language of the other. You can also turn this around and let the English, German, Thai, etc. communicate in Dutch.
So let everyone be in his worth and as long as it is understood and everyone is happy then it is fine.
An example of a Thai speaking English.
Today I request you 1 power bank.
So he wants a power bank… He's doing his best, I understand him. Improve? No, then you will have a different discussion.
I speak correct English at home to my partner and foster son.
But run into the lack of proper English on the other side. Have the impression that people learn USA English at school and the pronunciation, stop it. Chanel and Channel, we all know the pronunciation one picks up from TV. But what do you want with a minister (previous cabinet) who does not think English is necessary?
I stick to the rules as given at the HBS in the 60s and can still get ahead with that 'BBC English'. I also speak high Thai and stay away from Isaan and Lao. Boo!
I myself speak Twente with my Thai wife, which I successfully taught her to speak, she does not understand Dutch or English, from home she speaks a mix of Laos and Isaan, wonderful, but she could understand the Twente language reasonably well after a while speaking, must have to do with the grammar of Twente.
Goodgoan Eddy oet..555
I have learned that communication is only possible if the transmitter and the receiver are tuned to the same frequency. Just measure the frequency on which the receiver is and then also transmit on this frequency. Otherwise no communication is possible. Clearly so?
Dear Jerry,
If your parents had done what you suggest here, you would never have learned Dutch and Zeeland properly. And if your partner still understands very little English and you understand very little Thai, will you continue to make do with sign language for the next 20 years? You act as if the recipient is incapable of improving. That is indeed possible, but only if the transmitter cooperates.
Dear Tino, with the chance that the moderator will see this as chatting, I will give it a try. You (partly) hit the nail on the head. I did indeed learn Zeeuws Flemish from my parents, because my mother only attended primary school and my father started working after high school. I learned Dutch and English at school, but I am no more educated than the MULO and nouns with more than 3 syllables are foreign to me. “Sophisticated” English words also did not appear in our dictionary. But despite that, I was able to make do with my coal English in Yugoslavia and China. And yes, where the recipient did not understand I had to use sign language and drawings. Unknowingly, I am increasingly transferring my vocabulary to my current partner, because I notice that her English is improving because both our frequencies are slowly increasing, but one line at a time. I have never been ashamed of my low level of English, because once when I visited a farmer in England I apologized for my poor English, to which he replied "your English is much better than my Dutch" And I have that for the rest of remember my life.
I couldn't have said it better Gerrie, and my transmitter is perfectly tuned to my receiver!
Language is not meant to be used grammatically correct and in perfect pronunciation or to show how good you are. Language is, above all, a means of communication. The trick is to gauge the level of the person you are communicating with and adjust accordingly. If that's Tenglish or plain English, I don't care. If I am misunderstood with fast spoken English, the communication has failed.
Very many Thai people have a very low level of English proficiency. That's why I think it's important to be able to speak Thai. I do that everywhere, except at the doctor, the bank, the lawyer and the dentist. Then I want to be able to understand for sure what is being said. Incidentally, I am very happy with Thai people who slightly adjust their speaking speed when they communicate with me.
Part of the question must be how well the Dutch (or Belgian) person in question has mastered the English language.
I never try to speak full English to the people in the village if they try.
There is a few who sometimes dare to say a few words of English.
However, the pronunciation is so bad and unintelligible that I will not try to answer it in my best English.
The students do not understand English at all.
They can say a few sentences they have memorized, but they have absolutely no idea what they mean.
Good morning is said to me from early in the morning until late at night.
From the phrase "Good morning teacher, how are you?"
Apparently the teacher doesn't know what good morning means either.
Unfortunately, I must say I agree with Ruud's statement.
I have been in contact with some English teachers who did exactly that and rammed some sentences into students' heads where the pronunciation was very poor and the content was not understood. It is not possible to have a conversation or even get an answer.
I am convinced that there are other schools where things will go better, but unfortunately I don't know them.
There is still a lot of room for improving education. For the record, the Thais are certainly not stupid, but as has often been noted before, the level of education is deplorable.
Hi Ruud,
I once visited a high school during my volunteer work. I came into contact with the English teacher there. I didn't understand a word she said. When she teaches, how poorly do the students have to speak English?
Humiliating? what nonsense it is about people understanding you, if I want the Thai to speak good English, then I will teach it at a school. It is also true that most Dutch people do not even speak correct English themselves, a good example is myself and Louis van Gaal.
I can understand that people who are good at language(s) themselves and have made it their job, or that those who are proud to have learned Thai and English, are annoyed by this, but to get angry ( mmm).
When I first met my wife we spoke English to each other, and then I used those words and sentences that I knew she would understand me, did you think I would correct her every sentence she spoke? I had something else to do! (I was totally in love, you know!).
And after a year she spoke English mixed with a Rotterdam dialect (and that sounded great!!!) like: You are me d'r one(tje), or this I'm not crazy Henkie : I'm not crazy Henkie. and this Go your gang. And the great thing was I understood exactly what she meant and that's what it was all about, right? She never had the idea that I thought that as a Thai she was too stupid to learn English, and now in 2014 she speaks nice Dutch, mixed with a little bit of English and sometimes some Thai, which makes communicating even more fun, just yesterday then she asked me "Teerak, do you know where my Hend Beg is?" oh here I found um, I looked again with my nose.
Well Tino I just wanted to say that.
So your statement 'you shouldn't talk to a Thai with broken English but correct English, doesn't apply to us, we chatter nicely with each other.
think yo!
Farang Tingtong
Dear Farang Tintong.
I understand that you live in the Netherlands with your Thai partner and that she now speaks 'nice Dutch'. Would she have learned that if you hadn't just spoken normal Dutch with her? Apart from a joke now and then, because I do too. (khoeay mean tone instead of kloeay falling tone eg).
Most Thai women in the Netherlands want to learn Dutch well, which means that they expect their partner to help with this by simply speaking grammatically Dutch, in the beginning a bit more difficult but always correct. What's against that?
Dear Tino, Every bird sings according to its beak. You are absolutely right when you say that most Thai women want to learn Dutch well, and that does happen, I am sure that everyone puts their best foot forward in this, and not just the partner is important in this, but at work, and friends, etc. However, it must remain normal communication and not every conversation with your partner must turn into some kind of language course, I mean it must remain fun. I understand that you are very passionate about language, and that you have learned the Thai language, but not every person can do that, and not every person needs it. When I look at myself, language has never been of any use to me, it's just not my thing, and that goes for a lot of people. That's why it disgusts me if you want to impose it so strictly on people, or, as you say, you become devilish about it, let everyone be free, as Gerrie Q8 puts it so beautifully with his transmitter and receiver, because that's how it is. just in reality.
Van Kooten and de Bie about 'language problems', Turk and Dutch greengrocer.. Very nice.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzC1dhjq0Hw
dear moderator,
Can you also post this link below the post? He is so nice!
broken English (as in speaking "child language" to children in one's own language) is derogatory in a way and is a lack of respect and appreciation, let alone helping anyone. (child and or adults). Many Thais will certainly feel it and that's sad! (although not intended)
I agree with the statement that you should speak English as correctly as possible.
Have yet to meet the first Dutchman who speaks perfect English. We like to pat ourselves on the back that we have mastered English so well, but that is often very disappointing! It is not a problem that we speak English with a Dutch accent. There are so many accents in English that the Dutch accent can be part of it. Just like the Thai accent of English by the way (the rst in e.g. first remains difficult)
But Dutch people who ask 'how late is it?' …. aaarghl, back to school!
My experience is that when we, as non-native speakers of English, speak English as correctly as possible, we are well understood because our pace is much slower than that of native speakers and we are less inclined to use all kinds of expressions.
So just speak English as correctly as possible, and possibly slow down the pace a bit. If you do not understand, you can always explain yourself in Tenglish.
Many Thai think that every Farang speaks good English, and unfortunately take this as an example.
You also have Farang who adapt their English to a kind of Tenglisch, and think they can make themselves better understood as a result. That's why phrases like "Same Same", "My friend you" and "My friend me" arise, trying to make it clear whether they are talking about your friend or their own friend.
Because this sounds funny to many Farang, some speak back in the same way, so that the Thai gets the impression that this is good English. This problem, which is often underestimated, together with the often poor English education in Thailand, is to blame for the enormous backlog in English speech use, which is not really surprising.
It is humiliating not to try to speak the same language as your interlocutor, when you are (somewhat) able to do so.
With most Thai, that's broken English.
School English with Scandinavians.
It is difficult for me to communicate with a Scot if he continues to speak in his own dialect.
I expect a Frisian to speak Dutch with me.
And anything that promotes communication is allowed.
I often ask a German who speaks English to speak German to me, while I sometimes prefer to answer in English.
In Brussels I often get pissed off.
Hi Tino,
The youtube of Koot en de Bie is beautiful, especially the ending.
If I speak Dutch again after a month, then I have
after ten minutes a little bit of jaw pain (which passes quickly though). So
keep practicing.
I speak simple English with my wife unless she asks me for something
clarify. This is how she indicates to me that she feels like and has time to catch up
to learn. I take the time for that and give her as much as possible
examples with context. This way she can learn to taste the language.
She does the same to me for Thai. She needs Dutch
not for me to learn, but every now and then she surprises me with one
Dutch phrase. For example: Yes yes yes boy. Or: good morning
Greetings,
Climb.
It is primarily the intention that the addressee understands what is being said. Can possibly be done with hands and feet. In a relationship, understanding each other is a special point. I once knew a lady who spent three months staring at an English textbook but after three months had not learned anything and did not want to be helped. Another I also bought a textbook but found that the book could not even be read. Didn't even know the difference between d and b or e and c. I once met a woman who let a foreign man look for it on the internet. She asked me to teach the girls English. I quickly stopped. All texts were good to fill a sex booklet not to meet a man unless they were like-minded. It is very difficult to teach uneducated slightly older ladies the language. They expect to be able to speak fluently after a lesson. And quickly lose heart.
It is a fascinating subject and it also keeps me busy. My sister got angry when she heard me talking “Tenglish” (I didn't know this term yet) to my girlfriend. I understand that from her side, but at the same time I do have this experience: I constantly receive compliments from my girlfriend and her friends that they understand my English so well. Several friends have said to her: gee, I can never understand a Farang, but I can understand him very well. That's nice, but I can't give you a recipe because I don't know what I do for it myself.... In any case, I think it's important to talk to your girlfriend about this. And also from my side a big hmmm to Tino: become devilish when she does her best to be understandable for you? And now she's ex you say?
Of course you should try to speak correct, but if desired simple, English with Thai. It is less important for fleeting contacts, but if you have a Thai partner it seems to me the only way to achieve better mutual understanding. Of course you can also go far with hands and feet, but then you choose to go far back in evolution. Fortunately, I have a friend who is interested in the nuances of English. She wants to know exactly what the difference is between eg 'I would' and 'I should'. That way you get further. In the beginning I could just speak a little less simple English with friends and then she didn't understand anything. Now this is no longer possible and I have to watch what I say. Only if you find that a disadvantage should you stubbornly continue to use 'broken English',
I have a treasure of a woman and her family is also very sympathetic. But if I try to make something clear in English in a normal way, it is very, very difficult and the answer is in Thai, I don't understand. In contrast, in coal English it often succeeds. Hence. To all those years
that we are together. She still doesn't speak English correctly or well, just like with Dutch. And when I try to speak some Thai, it doesn't make much sense either. But she understands the way I speak Thai with her now. I think not that it has anything to do with respect or disrespect.
It sneaks in automatically.
Dear Tina,
Together with my son I was in Bangkok for two weeks. I have a comment to add to your response.
It's about being understood. I agree with the statement that talking with hands and feet often produces better results. Humiliation, I think, will never be the intention.
Humiliation occurs more often in disrespectful dealings with people.
I have worked in Southeast Asia for 25 years.
Seriously
We always shower together, lovely ! Incidentally, when I ask for the check or bill at the checkout in the catering industry, people do not understand me. The correct word in Tenglish is checkbill so I use it or make a writing gesture with my right hand. How humiliating?
Ron.
I usually pronounce it as "shek bin, khrap". The hardest part for me is getting attention before I can say that sentence.
Greetings,
Climb.
Dear,
My brother-in-law from Australia speaks fluent English with his Thai wife, but she doesn't understand him, when I'm there I translate his English into tenglish, and my sister-in-law understands.
My English is also lousy, but I sometimes communicate with my wife out of anger with my wife Poet Phassaa Ling, or cries like the monkeys do with each other, and that works perfectly, you have to look at each other of course,
Hands, feet and eyes and a monkey roar, works perfectly as long as you like each other!
Regards,
They read
In Thailand I often speak simple, starter level English: easy words, slow speaking pace, short sentences. With most of the Thai people I know through my wife, that works out pretty well. On the street it becomes a bit more difficult, I try to use simple English plus gestures, but if that doesn't work I still have to switch to Tenglish. Both transmitter and receiver must largely be on the same line, with people you meet more often you can slowly raise that level and talk to a slightly higher level each time.
With my (then) girlfriend I spoke normal (A2-B1 level) English, say second class Dutch secondary school. That went well, and I threw in more and more Dutch words. Together with stamping (lesson booklet), she passed the integration exam (A1 level) at the embassy. Once in the Netherlands it was a mix of simple Dutch (A1) and reasonable English (A2-B1), although the temptation to speak English was great. My girlfriend said she didn't like the fact that I kept switching to English. Then I almost only spoke Dutch with her, again by signing. For example, “Can you turn off the fan?” , pointing to the kno of the fan. It sometimes took a while for the penny to drop, and if things really got stuck, she had to speak in English, but her Dutch quickly improved by leaps and bounds. Of course with the necessary compliments from the few Thais she knows and from Dutch people. I completely agree that it is best to gently challenge your conversation partner from normal to increasingly higher English (or Dutch). But that is not always efficient at the market or in the store... Tenglish is sometimes necessary.
So I agree with the statement, with 1 nuance: you should NOT speak broken but (simple) correct English with Thai IF YOU CAN.
My friend often apologized to me that her English was not good enough. But I always reassured her by saying (and that is my opinion) that I am happy with every word she can speak. After all, I live in HER country and the one who has to make an effort to make herself understood is me. I should speak Thai and not expect her to speak perfect English. We now also speak broken English with each other. That English that most people use above. It is intelligible and is quite similar in syntax to Thai. I don't find it humiliating, but rather accommodating.
What I might find "humiliating" is when an American or Englishman falls into this kind of statement against me. Because my English is good. I often read books in English, watch every movie in English or with English subtitles and have absolutely no problem with it.
Funny thing was that a few weeks ago an elderly German lady asked me very surprised if I could speak Thai, when I helped her with a Thai workman who had to do something at her house. She barely spoke English, he the well-known Thai-English and I also spoke to him like that… she thought I spoke Thai!!!
So no. I don't think it's disrespectful, but rather respectful. I don't have to make a Thai interlocutor lose face because my English would be much better. You simply don't do that in Asia.
It is primarily about the communication between you and your partner, but to reach as large a group as possible, it seems better to me to try to speak correct English. You may of course wonder what correct English is because even people from different areas where English is the official language can hardly understand each other because of the accent they have. Of course you also have to watch out that you don't end up in such a situation like Koot and Bie at the greengrocer that Tino posted on the blog. So correct english is the first option for me.
Let me first say that I do agree with Tino's statement. I also have an easy time talking. My wife has foreign business partners and speaks good English. At work I always speak 'high school' English with my students and very occasionally French.
A few additional notes:
1. language is dynamic. Words are added (from oen to computer and smst in Dutch; strawberrie, computer and carrot in Thai) and the rules are sometimes adjusted. It is no easy matter for a Dutch person to write his/her mother tongue flawlessly. The annual dictation proves this time and time again.
2. English is pre-eminently a world language and has long ceased to be the language of 'native speakers' in England, the USA, Australia and some other countries. There are currently more Chinese studying English language than there are Americans on the planet. That will have consequences for this language in the long run, including for what is correct English or not.
3. Tino's problem will probably be solved within 10 years. Recently read an article that so much progress is being made with the speed and quality of translation computers (translation chips) that within a few years it will be possible to speak Dutch to your Thai wife who hears Thai through a device in her ear. She can simply answer in Thai and you will hear correct Dutch through a device in your ear.
It remains that, in my opinion, language is not only communication, but also a part of culture: from literature to humor and the expression of a particular nation. For that you have to learn to read and write the language and not just speak it.
I wasn't going to respond at first, but I find the statement ridiculous, so I do it anyway.
And because of the fact that if you start talking in perfect English here in Thailand, the majority will simply not understand you.
They often don't even understand you in bad English, let alone in perfect English.
And then you can defend the Thai as the handsome white knight that they can really learn it and so on, but the point is that you speak in the future and not in the moment itself.
The moment you get a (humiliating and antisocial) UHHH answer to a normal English sentence, you immediately make the sentence a lot simpler so that she understands it.
And if you succeeded, you will probably do it again next time.
Humiliating ?
I speak Thai myself, because I wanted to get rid of those poor English conversations myself.
As a result, I now understand the Thai very well and let's not talk about humiliating, because believe me they have better control of humiliating than we do.
What they sometimes say about a complete stranger farang when you just stand there is sometimes really below par.
Only when they hear that you understand, do they smile friendly and suddenly talk a lot nicer.
I also don't find it humiliating to adjust your level of English so that you can still communicate with those who do not have a good command of it.
I actually think it's social.
Vinny, you hit the nail on the head. It is not only found here in Thailand, even in England "sleng" english is spoken in many cities. Nothing degenerating about it and people understand each other. You have to look at it more like a dialect.
Communication with my wife started in English, her English was limited, especially in terms of vocabulary. I speak reasonable English, slowly but surely I have continued to use more English words and their explanations, until we agreed that I would no longer have any restrictions in the use of the English words. Never did I speak Tenglish to her, seemed unwise to us. So it went fine. We did the same with the Dutch language. It also went well, she now also reads Dutch, great results.
But if I speak to a Thai who speaks a single word of English and cannot understand my English at all when I use it grammatically correctly, then I switch to Tenglish or, where possible, to the Thai language or hands and feet, in short, adapting here and there to the practical possibilities is then more important to be able to communicate than non-communication.
It's amazing how many responses there are! It keeps people busy…
My take on the matter. English is the most tolerant language in the world!
English is about the only language in the world that you can grow without the native speakers falling over you. Do you speak, I say, Spanish, or French or Dutch, then the speakers mentioned will always make you feel that you speak their language falteringly. Or they improve you. Or, after all, you don't belong. We Dutch speakers in particular have a hand in it. People often use a language to be separatist. Migrants among themselves.
I have not yet had a single Briton, Australian, etc. know how to do that with me, to improve myself. They accept that their language is used as a kind of intermediate language between people to communicate, to do a 'content'. And that something like that results in 'coal-English', no problem.
That is the great strength of English as a language! And from the native English speakers. The flexibility with which they deal with changes. As a result, English will survive the great globalization. Conversely, 2000 years ago most of Europe and also North Africa spoke Latin – through the Roman Empire. That language is now dead!
Finally: of course a Thai understands your ramshackle English better than they understand a native speaker from England, US etc. At that level we find each other with our limitedness in English. Our vocabulary is simpler, our sentences simpler.
Conclusion: fascinating that with so little knowledge, vocabulary, pronunciation, syntax of English you can make yourself so clearly understood all over the world... That shows the unique properties of English. With the same amount of Chinese, Arabic, Dutch, etc. you would be nowhere.
Watch out: Me love Dutch!
41 Responses to the above statement. Pffff, I hardly dare to make it 42.
“ME TOO”
Now if we start trying to write ABN on this blog. Because we can expect that from the Dutch. And then check a comment for typing errors (or is it typing errors?). Then we've come a long way. Because let's be honest, what can you expect from someone's English if their Dutch doesn't deserve a beauty prize, to put it in political jargon.
Then I want to ask the question: “Don't Americans speak coal English? Don't South Americans speak coal Spanish? Is there even a Chinese language?” Chinese refers to Standard Mandarin, the official language of the People's Republic of China, Taiwan and one of the official languages of Singapore. But Wikipedia says: “Chinese or Chinese languages is a collective name for a group of languages that together form the Sinitic branch of the Sino-Tibetan language family.” The standard language is based on Beijinghua, the Beijing dialect of Mandarin. In fact, Chinese can be regarded as a macro language, consisting of 10 to 15 languages. So we cannot speak of “Chinese”.
I speak coal English simply because I never learned it properly. I apologize many times, but then am reassured. Indeed, it is about whether your interlocutor understands you. If someone tells me something in good English that I don't understand, I'm not ashamed to say it. Often I have to ask (also in Thailand) if someone can understand English, then I usually get to hear: “a little bit”. And then I say: "Me too"
I like this comment… Here you see comments from people who are proud to speak Thai or English, but can't even write a sentence with the “d” and the “t” in the right place of the word. To me it's like when you scratch your fingernails on a blackboard...
In addition to what I wrote: my work allowed me to work with Thai colleagues for many years. These were all from good families, had an education behind them and also spoke decent English. And when a good acquaintance visits me from Bangkok, I talk to her in normal English. I speak “Thai-English” with my girlfriend. My girlfriend doesn't mind that and actually no one is bothered by that.
I was married to a Brazilian for years and often visited Brazil. My Portuguese was never great, but I was able to make myself understood. My then mother-in-law could talk to me well and I understood what she was saying. My ex-father-in-law, on the other hand, simply couldn't speak more simply and I couldn't understand a word of it. I always experienced that as painful and I felt dumber than I was.. I learned more Portuguese over time, and just before the divorce I was finally able to have a conversation with him…
Through this marriage I have learned that you have to learn the language YOURSELF. You can be motivated, but in the end you learn it yourself. My ex-wife was never able to teach me proper Portuguese. And even now my girlfriend is trying to help me with Thai. But hearing a word does not teach you a language. It's just practice and more practice. Who's interested in that now? A Thai who hardly or hardly uses English should not be blamed for not being able to speak good English. As I said, we should try to learn THEIR language and not the other way around. And that's why just by speaking Thai-English you can meet people and it's far from humiliating. Well, if I were to talk to my former Thai colleague like that. Because her English is fine. Then Thai-English is a “no-go”.
I agree with the statement. But not because I like good English better, but because it is easy to learn the Thai language. That is easier than turning around for a Thai. But most foreigners quickly realize that you don't need Tahis to order a beer and get into bed with your Thai girlfriend. So hardly anyone learns the Thai language. A matter of outspoken laziness
I think it just shows respect if you talk to your interlocutor in a normal way, whether in English, German or Dutch.
If I couldn't do that, I would try to learn it very quickly.
If I spoke tenglish to my wife even just for fun it would not be appreciated.
In many responses I read that people prefer to talk in a kind of Tenglisch, because they are of the opinion that otherwise communication is almost impossible. Through the rules you read a kind of laziness, or unwillingness for improvements, and are satisfied, as long as people understand each other. Others think it sounds funny, and think that this form of communication is typical for Thailand, which of course makes sense, because they never improve, and have not learned better themselves. Now improving every time in a communication is often very disturbing, but in a private conversation, with the desire to learn better English, usually a method that is gratefully accepted. The problem is if children arise from a Thai-Farang marriage, or children from a first relationship were already present in the household, that these children adopt the same crooked English, in the belief that if a Farang speaks that way, it must be correct. When I learned Thai I was happy with my Thai partner, because I could ask every time if I pronounced it right, especially considering the different pitches that are very important in Thai speech, and which I didn't learn so easily without a Thai partner had. Even now I say daily that I am not offended when she corrects me, appreciates me, and wishes these corrections when she speaks. You could also say it very pointedly, if you never corrected a child in the Netherlands, and the same language also started talking, then we would get a very strange language. The dog was still called "Wou Wou", the Car "Tuut Tuut" and the cat "Miau".
If you look at the educational programs on Thai TV, the lessons in foreign languages, it becomes clear. The teachers also speak in a very strange way. Gramatically, yes they know that, but then the pronunciation, As so often in Thailand, bad teachers who often have not done the required training. I had one cum laude chemical engineer from Chulalonkorn Uni who didn't know what a mass balance was and then your clog breaks and you wonder how much the father paid for the masters degree
A nice statement, but then some reactions, great!!!!!. I often found the responses even funnier (is it funnier or mor funny) in written Dutch than your statement
It is apparently too much effort for cb1max to explain what he/she likes about the comments. It's not mor funny or even more funny, but it's funnier or more fun. But where even basic English is too difficult, the statement does not apply there and it seems to me that people can babble freely.