Recently there was a question on Thailand blog about where to sign the SVB life certificate. One of the three remaining options is the Thai SSO. The other two options are: the Dutch embassy in Bangkok, and the Dutch consulate in Phuket: www.thailandblog.nl/ Readers Question/svb-levensproof-laten-ondertekenen-en-stempelen/
I think this is very meager considering the number of Dutch pensioners in Thailand, and therefore recipients of an AOW benefit every month. That must be easier and better, I thought. For example, via the DigiD app and a linked ID check, and if that is not (yet) technologically possible, then close by in person at Thai Immigration, at a local Amphur or a lawyer's office.
The Stichting GOED www.stichtinggoed.nl/ working to expose the user-unfriendliness of DigiD. How nice would it be if she could get both DigiD and the SVB to the table. Of course not only for the benefit of people living in Thailand with old age pensions, but also for those elsewhere on our planet. GOED works together with, among others, the NVT-Dutch Association Thailand. It must absolutely be possible to get the necessary arguments from this club.
On August 1, I asked Stichting GOED the following question:
“A large number of Dutch people live in Thailand with their state pension. The SVB asks them to provide proof of life each year. As of 2019, this proof must be signed by an employee of:
- the Dutch Embassy in Bangkok, or from;
- the Dutch Consulate on the island of Phuket, or;
- at one of the provincial offices of the Thai institution SSO-Social Security Office.
For many AOW pensioners, this means that they have to travel a lot: kilometers from their place of residence to the nearest SSO office. Fine if you are 68 years old, less if you are over 80, or sick, or less mobile.
Previously, it was also possible to sign the certificate at the police station of the place of residence, at the town hall, at the Immigration office or at a notary.
Question: can Stichting GOED plead with the SVB to deal less stringently with whom and where in Thailand can and may sign the life certificate?
If it is not possible for the Foundation in connection with processing its own list of priorities, can the GOED Foundation indicate how collectively a signal can be sent to the SVB?
Do you know whether, for example, you can involve the Dutch Association Association in Bangkok as a partner organization?
Today (August 5) I received in reply:
“Many thanks for the information regarding the SVB life certificate. The "Proof of Life" is on our priority list. We will most likely pick this up in the fall, at this point we have already received a lot of feedback from Dutch people worldwide. In any case, I will present this specific problem to our representative in Thailand and ask his advice to what extent we as a Foundation can provide support in this.”
Proposal: dear readers, consider the answer as a call to provide both GOED and the NVT with the necessary arguments that can be used to bring about a turnaround at SVB in the autumn of 2019. Mail addresses? See respective websites!
Submitted by RuudB
Does anyone know how to find the address of the local SSO?
Khon Kaen in my case.
I'm not ready for the state pension yet, and until now I could go to the Amphur for signatures, but still handy for the future.
Many Thais also have to use the SSO, then the address will have to be known at the amphur or immigration in your area.
For Jomtien/Pattaya that is Laem Chabang 15 km away.
just google Social Security Office Khon Kaen and you will come across a number of websites
http://www.sso.go.th/khonkaen/
https://map.longdo.com/p/A00008826/mobile?locale=en
I think the SVB can send you a list,
Previously, the SVB sent the list of SSO offices with the application for a life certificate !!
Why they don't do that anymore is a mystery.
Dear Ruud,
I read on the website of the SVB that a trial has been started in Turkey by chatting with an employee. just show your passport and answer a few questions. It's too simple for words. Living proof through the video.
For now, this is just a test.
Did you know that the SVB encourages fraud. They ask not only whether you are alive, but also about your living situation. Whether you share the front door or you live together, etc. This cannot be checked by many municipalities (Amphur), embassy, SSO offices, but they will sign for this. What will the Dutch judiciary do about this?
Regards Anthony
I actually had 2 inspectors from the SVB visit Pattaya who checked all kinds of things, cohabitation, etc. by simply opening a cupboard door to see if there were any women's clothing in it (they did ask nicely first, but I didn't think refusing would be an option). a best act and I have nothing to hide either)
Months later received a nice letter that everything was fine
Groet
Piet
How about proof of being alive via Whats app, Line, Skype, Messenger, Facebook?
Then one can provide proof via a video call and one can show the passport via the camera as proof that they have the right person in front of them.
There are no costs involved and it goes a lot faster.
Also, no evidence can get lost like this happens at the post.
I think every emigrant has an internet connection and they don't want them to stay behind with the government in the Netherlands as far as digital traffic is concerned via the internet, do they?
Not so very difficult, ffff googling SSO KHON KAEN and you're already there, page in English or translate to Dutch.
The story is several years old. Why the letter writer states as of 2019 is a mystery. Furthermore, a few days ago there was an item with many advices on the site. So scroll back.
Why only the SVB? You will have 4 pensions and see that they all have 4 different rules AND different dates to turn in. A good coordination will make a big difference, although there are pension payers who accept a copy of the SVB certificate.
Dear Erik,
Good coordination is not in the economic interest. I sent a correct life statement from the BPF to the SVB, which was not accepted. The SVB has its own forms that aim the same thing but look different.
Regards Anthony
Anthony, and I did it the other way around. I was allowed to use a state stamp from the SSO for the SVB for my Zwitserleven pension after a detailed explanation of the function of the SSO (the Thai UWV) and the agreement between SVB and NL. And then it squeaked.
It will take some effort to get all pension payers on the same page, but if you don't dare, you don't win. It's worth a try.
I have different experience though. In addition to SVB, 3 other supplementary pensions. I haven't had to do anything for that for years, because they simply take over the SSO/SVB determination.
Why only the SVB? What do you pay attention to also raise the issue, and report the results on Thailandblog.
Ruud,
If you mean me then the following. I asked my other pension funds how they deal with “Proof of Life” and whether I had to provide proof of this every year. All three: not necessary, because they apparently have access to that information via SVB.
And that has been going well from the start. So I only have to go to SSO once a year.
I cannot guarantee that all pension funds do/can do this. Obviously not, because otherwise there wouldn't be a discussion about this on the blog.
RuudB, for that you have to go to the umbrella organization of insurers AND to the SVB AND to the ABP. If they all start asking for the life certificate in the month of your birthday, that would make a big difference.
You are a topic starter here so I advise you to raise it with the contacts you already have a warm heart for.
And what do you do if the Amphur does not want to draw .
A notary where can you find it just anywhere in Thailand.
I happened to be at the Amphur in Pasang today for my empathy proof of the ABP.
The head of the civil affairs department did not want to sign, I had to go to the embassy.
I then grabbed my cell phone on the spot and called a lady who works at the provincial tax office in Lamphun.
She was talking to the chief for a while.
Oh you also have yellow home book and Thai purple ID card.
I had even been registered with this municipality for several years.
Then what changed what I got was some sort of excerpt-like form even in English and Thai from the population register with the name Thor Ror 14/1 that he wanted to sign on day date, but the empathetic statement from the ABP he still didn't sign.
I will send both forms stapled together back to ABP and see if it is accepted or not.
The nagging is now starting for me because I am over 66 and will soon be confronted with 3 pension funds every year.
Two weeks ago I went to the SSO in Lamphun with the sympathetic statement from the PMT metal pension fund.
Don't just sign for the SVB either.
They also said I had to go to the Dutch embassy in Chiangmai, I never knew that there is also a Dutch embassy in Chiangmai.
Then I went to a private hospital in the city of lamphun and had the empathetic statement signed by a doctor who can both speak and read English well.
I read here with some of the above comments that they managed to do it at the local Amphur.
Congratulations.
I live in the city of Pasang where quite a few foreigners live but they are not known on the Amphur I was the first and only one with Yellow book and registration.
From the looks of it, it is a great bureaucratic arbitrariness and unknown is unloved by the local Amphur here.
Jan Beute
Dear Jan, the PMT accepts a copy of the SVB statement and that is also stated in the letter. Many pension funds do this. So just go to SSO 1x per year and then send a copy to the pension fund. I sent another copy to the PMT at the beginning of the month and received confirmation that it has been processed.
Thanks Rob for your advice, only my first pension benefit from the PMT starts earlier than my SVB AOW benefit.
And in the letter I received for the application for the pension from the PMT, it was not written about that an SVB statement can also be used with regard to the living statement.
I wait to see how the PMT and ABP will respond.
Jan Beute.
I had the same problem last year.
This involved a living form from a pension fund
Amphur has refused to sign ,
because they can't read it.
SSO in Khorat only sign form from SVB and keen other .
Then went to a Notary in Khorat and signed it for 3000 Baht
and this was enough.
Dear Chris, even if you come up with a translated version in Thai, translated by a recognized translator, they still refuse to sign it here.
Civil servants here are afraid of losing their quiet job with a reasonably good Thai government pension if they sign something they don't know.
Unknown makes unloved is the slogan here at Amphur.
So their cry loud, go to your embassy where ever it is.
Jan Beute.
What a question completely superfluous to ask here, it is necessary for the SVB to go to a competent authority 1X A YEAR AND PROVE THAT YOU ARE ALIVE.
The fact that this is no longer allowed / is not possible with Thai authorities is because they are still easy to bribe and therefore not to be trusted, same money for those visa agencies, you can no longer go there for your proof of income, so just go to the DUTCH EMBASSY or CONSULATE and / or to the SSO which is the only Thai institution accepted by the SVB.
Exactly, and we want to get rid of that, because it is too limited. That should be possible with today's technology. Antonius reports at 12:19 pm that the SVB is conducting a test in Turkey to find out via chat whether you are still alive. Skype is also such a possibility.
Dear Jeffrey, the Thai SSO is also a government institution, and is it the only institution that cannot be bribed then?
Depends on the attitude of a single person or several people, and believe me in every country in the world, not only in Thailand, there are officials that can be bribed, even in the Netherlands and Belgium.
Read it yourself regularly in the news.
And why go to the Dutch embassy? I read on this and other blogs that they are already very busy with their daily activities.
This is partly due to the austerity anger of our last cabinets.
And even outsourced the Schengen visa applications to some visa agency somewhere in Bangkok.
Jan Beute.
There is an office of the SSO in every large or medium-sized city in Thailand, you will be kindly helped with filling in the life certificate for the SVB, and it is free, it couldn't be easier.
I had to have one last week, but for Belgium so I don't know if it is valid for the Netherlands. I had to email them the document to be signed by the embassy, together with a photo of the newspaper of the day or a certificate from the doctor. I had just been to the doctor the day before, so sent that along. Two days later I received the requested certificate, also by email.
That is also Philip, that I prefer to go to a qualified doctor in an accredited hospital.
Because who can't determine the difference between life and death better than a doctor.
Even in the case of a death in the Netherlands, including my parents, the doctor first came to determine the death and only then did the town hall with civil affairs come into play.
So what's wrong with having a licensed physician sign the survival certificate with stamp and bill from an accredited hospital somewhere in Thailand.
Seems better to me than some official on an Amphur somewhere in Thailand who still knows the ins and outs and not to mention some knowledge of the English language.
And believe me, the doctors I've encountered here in all the years I've been here could read and write all English and some even German.
Jan Beute.
Just the consequence of living / living in Thailand. By accepting the payment you also accept the obligations that this entails. In other words, the benefits also the burdens. What is the objection for the unemployed to have to travel a few times a year in order to fulfill the obligation resulting in the entitlement to the benefit being paid out?
Dear Frans, what is the objection.
When you get older or have difficulty walking or your health fails, I think you will soon start to think differently.
Then a trip to Bangkok alone can be more of a torment than a blessing.
And about the benefits and the burdens the following.
Didn't we ourselves, the employees and also the employers, earn years and years with our hard-earned money through hard work, not invest in pension funds ourselves and also paid AOW contributions.
Jan Beute.