In February of this year I wrote a story in 10 daily parts about how I ended up in Thailand, what I went through, how I got into a steady relationship and how I actually protect myself.

The last part, see www.thailandblog.nl/ Readers-inzending/thailand-ligt-slotwoord, I end with the hope that in 10 years I will write more about our experiences, but that is of course very far away. It's been a while, so I thought it was time to add to my story. I have already said that I would go on holiday to the Netherlands with the whole family and that is what this story is mainly about.

Just in advance

I always write about my girlfriend Rash, because we are not married and do not have a cohabitation contract. I wouldn't want that either, but it is true that we simply live life as husband and wife. But in writing, it's my girlfriend. That's the same as I write about her daughter Terry. I have spoken about my daughter before and it feels that way and in fact it is. My own daughter put the pin on me that I only had one real daughter and I had to agree with her. So that's why I'm writing about her daughter, in my heart I love her like my own daughter.

The preparation

A visa is required for a trip to the Netherlands with Thai travel companions and applying for it was not without a struggle. With my girlfriend and Noon, a niece of Rash, who would also come along, I visited the Dutch embassy for the visa application and the guarantee. You can read below how that turned out for the niece.

My friend Rash also wanted to apply for Terry, but that was not possible, Terry had to be present in person for the fingerprints. I did say, process the application now and Terry will pick up the passport himself and then fingerprints can be made, don't think about it! Well, rules are rules, right?

The visa for Rash was in order within two days, we had to go back to the embassy again for the visa for Terry. Her application was initially rejected. I did not understand this, Terry had already been to the Netherlands 2 times before. So an angry email to Kuala Lumpur where visas are issued/refused. Two days later I got a call back that there had been a mistake regarding Terry's application. The documents had been rejected blindly because she had almost the same last name with cousin Noon. So that was still fine.

The application for the niece Noon

Noon, a niece of Rash (daughter of her sister) would also come along to the Netherlands. I had sent an accompanying letter with the application, in which I explained her personal circumstances and confirmed the guarantee. She was sawn through at the embassy about the fact that one could see in the passport that she went to Kuala Lumpur many times by plane. Noon explained with papers that she worked for an international company and provided training for the subsidiary in Kuala Lumpur for that company. That was simply not trusted and the application was rejected on the grounds of unclear whereabouts and uncertainty about returning to Thailand.

I thought that was absurd, because my letter clearly stated that Noon would stay in my house, that we would go on holiday together and that I would bring her back to Schiphol in time for the return journey. She would stay in the Netherlands for two weeks and we would stay for a month. Also made a guarantee for her. It was an absurd rejection for me. She had steady work, had papers that she could return to her employer where she had been working for 4.5 years with a very good income for a Thai lady. In fact, she wouldn't even be able to get that in the Netherlands.

What now? Well, we had to go to the embassy again for the application for Terry and made a second attempt to get a visa for Noon. Noon had her papers in order and expanded them a bit and I supplemented my letter with the announcement that I was prepared to deposit 50.000 euros as an extra guarantee on a third-party account with a notary. In spite of everything, the application was rejected again.

I then sent all the documents to a lawyer in the Netherlands, who also thought that the rejection was completely unjustified. He wanted to take action to straighten things out, but Noon had told me that she no longer wanted to come to the Netherlands. She felt she was not welcome and then booked a holiday with friends to Japan.

My comments

There is simply a hand lifted there in Kuala Lumpur with visa issuance, do not read, do not call for further explanation if necessary. Still incomprehensible to me. They also indicate in Kuala Lumpur that they do not trust me, after all, I am the guarantor. The duration of issuing visas is also completely different as I learn from this blog, some get 1 year visa, others until the end of the passport date and others for 3 years. Not meaning that you can stay there for so long, stay is a maximum of 90 days and then you are not allowed to enter for 180 days.

So it was better for Noon that she had a child or her own house here in Thailand to obtain a visa. How can you expect that from someone who works and also studies in her spare time and weekends at the university in Bangkok. She uses her opportunity to move even higher up the ladder in terms of function.

The journey to Schiphol

So it happened that the three of us traveled to the Netherlands at the beginning of April. We were neatly taken to Savarnabhumi by a friend and arrived in the Netherlands after a very good flight with Eva Air. Always a drama at passport control in the Netherlands, too few counters open, just scandalous. Then to the band to collect our luggage, which always takes quite some time.

I had a large box with my luggage, which would come separately and it arrived even before the rest of the luggage. In that box was a 42 inch TV, which I bought in Thailand 4 years ago. I had already bought a new TV for my house in Thailand and my house in the Netherlands no longer had a TV, so that "old" TV was a nice solution, so we could still watch television. I had counted on having problems with such a large box at customs control, but there was no one to be seen there and we were able to walk through, so that was not too bad.

To Groningen

My brother-in-law was waiting for us outside at the agreed place, all in the car and then heading north. All in all, we were at my house around 23.30:XNUMX pm, or at my mother's who lives next door. Family was waiting for us all, mother had prepared a nice cup of soup and later a beer as a nightcap. It was really fun that way. The vacation had begun.

I was supposed to return to Thailand with Rash and Terry at the beginning of May, but I had extended my ticket to the end of May. My son wanted to have the garden ready which I would do and I would also work in the garden with my sister, everything had to be changed there due to the construction of a large conservatory. Fun to do, we first laid out the garden 24 years ago.

After a wonderful night's sleep, we still had to go shopping to get the necessary things to eat, shower, etc. Fortunately, I have an apartment in the middle of the center and a newly built shop where we could buy our food, was located next to our apartment. That was a nice outcome. However, when we came outside we felt the cold in the Netherlands, yes that was a bit shivering. After having bought everything and cleaned up and also packed luggage, connected TV and worked, another day had passed.

Mother dear came every now and then to see if everything really worked. Had said to my mother as long as we are here you will come and eat with us, she has the key to my house, easy. Just to clarify my mother is 81 years old and lost her boyfriend to illness in February. So the fact that we came was also a distraction for her.

Rash made Thai food her way, but not too sharp for us, because I don't like that either. My mother looked a bit strange at it, loved it afterwards and asked all sorts of things how do you make this, how do you make that? Really she was full of praise.

The first days

Took it easy the first few days, went to Groningen together, mother also came along and also picked up my own car that was still in the garage at my other house. Quite an oldie, now 37 years old. A drunk, 6 cylinder Mercedes Benz. Anyway, drives like a limousine. That big battleship, as my mother said, had to go in the parking garage and my mother had problems with that. Because our places in that garage are next to each other, my mother said if you park the car there, I will not be able to enter my parking space with my car. Solved that problem to switch parking bay, now the problem was solved.

Schedule

We had made a plan for the rest of the holiday, Rash wanted to go to France for a few days and we would go sailing with Cor, an acquaintance (always stays in Thailand for 2 to 3 months) who has a boat for a few days. And of course Keukenhof is on the program, but also the flower parade in Lisse. After all, Rash knows that very well after 4 times in the Netherlands.

Gardening

Worked in my sister's garden the first week, everything had to be removed and because now everything could be deposited nicely at an Easter bonfire, I cut down forests and trees of 12 meters with a chainsaw on the first Saturday, which my brother-in-law with a friend were taken away. They could rent a cheap mini crane to get the roots out, yes I used to have one myself so I could handle it. It took three days to remove the stumps and dig the garden at a depth of about 1.5 meters, water did not want to go away properly, there was a peat plate that had been compressed over the years. It was also nice for me to do these things again and also for my sister and brother-in-law, who had already done a lot for me and still do if I need them.

Keukenhof

Then we went to Keukenhof, mother with me, my youngest brother with us and also thick coats with us, brrr a bit cold. Also made some sandwiches in advance and bought something to drink. Great day at Keukenhof, Rash and Terry took over 750 photos that day, so well captured. What struck me most was that Terry even took off her coat and was absolutely not cold and I couldn't stand it that cold it was.

Boat trip

We had planned the boat trip, which started from Zaltbommel, where Cor lives, so that after four days we were in Lisse to view the flower parade. But first it went to the city center of Utrecht. That was great to see the city center from the boat, just bad luck that it was so cold, you could barely sit on the back deck and there were no people on the many terraces on the water. Via the Vecht (a lot of rich people live there) to the Amsterdam harbor and of course we moved into Amsterdam, but not for long, the ladies thought it was too cold.

Flower Parade Lisse

The next day to Lisse, where we arrived well in time. On Friday evening we had a spot near the bridge where the corso would pass, so perfect. Called my niece who lives in Lisse and where we would drop by that Saturday evening before we went home. My car was still in Zaltbommel and on Saturday morning there was still enough time to get it, my niece picked us up and took me to the train and showed the women a bit of Amsterdam and brought them back to the boat for the parade. I was also back in plenty of time so everything was neatly arranged. I didn't think Corso was as beautiful as other years we had seen together. Anyway. The necessary photos were taken again and Rash even ended up in a photo in the Leids Dagblad. Nice again, ended the day with Cor and his wife and thanked and also paid something for the pleasant and perfect trip, despite the cold, but definitely worth doing it again, but then in the summer. Yes, the Netherlands is also a beautiful country. The evening continued with my niece with an excellent dinner and shared some experiences and catch up, actually a little late to the north but with a very satisfied feeling and the ladies in a deep sleep in the car.

Trip to France

The trip to France was cancelled. I had tried twice to book a bus trip, but both could not go ahead due to lack of interest. I was not sad about that, especially since we had to leave late Sunday evening, while we had just arrived home from Lisse in the early Sunday morning. Yes, I'm also getting older one day, you don't want it but you will hear it.

Nice at home

We stayed home for the rest of the holiday. Of course we have done some other trips, visited friends, cozy family dinner in a world restaurant with Thai food and seen an Easter fire up close. And of course not to forget, Rash had made up my mother with some cosmetics and she liked that so much that she came every morning to let Rash do her make-up. My mother enjoyed it and really said you have a sweet wife, be careful with it. That was special, because in the distant past my mother had read something about Thai women and I was always reminded of it. In short, Rash is valued and respected by my entire family, they love her and miss her even more now that she is back in Thailand. Otherwise, I hear. They are now apping Wats with each other, isn't it great.

Rash and Terry return to Thailand

In short, a nice and successful holiday but much too cold, nice to have strengthened the family ties again and to see a proud mother. But time had come for Rash and Terry to say goodbye. Mother definitely wanted to go to Schiphol to see them off. Rash and daughter left for Thailand, Rash had brought cheese for someone who would pick Rash up from the airport in Thailand and bring it home as a thank you, perfect right?

My departure to Thailand

I stayed behind in the Netherlands and was able to work with my son and also with my sister. I also had to do some repairs and some paint work in my other house where my daughter lived for 5 years, because that house was rented out again. At the end of May I had everything ready, signed leases and handed over the keys.

Then another two days of busy buying everything to bring my suitcase to the right weight, you always buy too much, those kilos go fast. So my return trip to Thailand had started and also had a good flight. Rash was waiting for me with the car at the airport and when I got home it turned out that Rash had everything in order again, my beer was cold, the dog had recovered a bit, he had missed us a lot.

I myself had a fantastic time in the Netherlands, no songs for a while, no heat every day. Just saw my grandchildren and played with them, could cycle for a while, relax and drive a car, what a pleasure.

Final contemplation

What more can a man desire with such a Thai woman by your side. Yes I am a privileged person, of course there are sometimes dark clouds, or a little less sun. Sometimes angry about comments they make or about what they want, but time heals that too. When I look at other foreigners living with their Thai wives and how they get caught, then I can't complain and I won't.

Still, I want to write something about how a life is ruined or influenced by Thai women who want too much and don't think, I have seen and still see enough examples about this in my immediate environment. But let's not forget the naivety of the men, of course. I always say protect yourself. So count on it, I will come back again with that story and really what happened and what is still going on.

Submitted by Roel

9 Responses to “Reader Submission: Where is Thailand? (the sequel)"

  1. Kampen butcher shop says up

    Noon's rejection is not entirely clear to me. If she has an income higher than she could get in the Netherlands, why do you have to act as a guarantor? I have had several people visit here in the Netherlands. Without money, I also had to pay for the ticket. With work, just paid the ticket and after that it cost me a fortune on trips here. They must also see something when they are here, right? And everything is expensive here. The best: Beautiful lady. Friend of my wife. A good income in Bangkok. I didn't even have to guarantee and it didn't cost me anything. Paid for everything myself and often for me too.
    Made sure my fridge was full every day.
    Still remember the beer was missing. Essential for me. "I'll get it for you," she said. "Me: Thanks, but I'll buy that myself." Look, guys like that can stay for a year. But she had to go back to Thailand to run her business there. As for the rest: Nice people, but it's all too expensive for me anyway. I stopped. Buy a ticket yourself, but stand at Schiphol with an empty wallet. Maybe next year I should arrive at Suvarnabhumi with an empty wallet.

    • Roel says up

      Kampen butcher shop,

      Noon had just bought a new car and paid in cash, she still had about 100.000 baht in the bank and that was also added to the visa application. If that car had not been paid for, she would have had more than enough money and I would not have had to guarantee it.

      I don't understand the rejection at all and the grounds for rejection are just a bullshit story. Her stay in the Netherlands was known, so it was not an issue. I also stood as guarantor, so for a maximum of 150.000 euros over a period of 5 years that the Dutch state could claim from me if Noon did not return. In any case, it is certain to me that they have not read my accompanying letter at all. I think they are just playing a game there in Kuala Lumpur with their eyes closed as to who is and who is not and when they have their rejection percentage, the next person can get a visa again, mainly because they do not look at the content of the papers.

      • Kampen butcher shop says up

        Delegating these kinds of decisions to “Kuala Lumpur” whatever that means (kind of subcontractor?) has certainly not been an improvement. Someone also told me that my wife's daughter had better conceal that she runs a restaurant in southern Thailand. “Then only more questions will be asked” Just guarantee, nothing else. Goes smoother. Incidentally, that guarantor does entail a risk. Know someone who vouched for someone who disappeared without a trace after arriving here.
        A potentially expensive joke.

        • Rob V says up

          Kuala Lumpur is simply a collection of Foreign Office visa handling officials in Malaysia rather than scattered across various embassies in the region. For the citizen, this meant longer lead times, the need to translate (more) supporting documents as there is no longer any support to translate Thai documents. More about this in:
          https://www.thailandblog.nl/visum-kort-verblijf/afgifte-schengenvisums-thailand-loep-2016/

          KL will also close its doors in 2019 and BuZa will arrange everything from NL, which can still be a party. But it's all cost efficient.

          There is no need to conceal the fact that you run a restaurant, having a restaurant is actually an asset to show that you have a connection with Thailand (reason for return, smaller chance of illegal stay in Europe). Naturally, people will want to know whether it is your restaurant and how you have arranged your absence. An A4 letter can make things clear, and there are hardly any questions to be asked. But even with a guarantor, as a foreigner you can expect to be asked what obligations/ties you do/don't have with Thailand. Do you sometimes not have a job? Denying that you have an income from work (restaurant) would be a lie and it is not a plus if you apparently have no income and therefore no connection with TH.

      • Rob V says up

        That is why you should always immediately object, right from the first rejection. As a foreign national, this can often be done for less than 200 euros due to subsidized legal aid (someone with a low wage by Dutch standards can get a lawyer with a subsidy, formerly known as ProDeo).

        A one-page letter in which she briefly explains that she works and travels frequently, proof of employment, employer contact details. Those should be positives: good income, good employment, good travel history. Easy to check, for example through the attached employment contract or employer letter plus contact details of the employer. If a civil servant then thinks 'there are quite a few women who earn money outside Thailand' (and that category means that this work can also take place in the Netherlands), such a thought could quickly be corrected. The Netherlands now receives thousands of requests and not all of them are evenly distributed, for example the high season is the Dutch spring (Thai Songkran, April, May), busy busy busy. With a good job, being a guarantor for yourself would have been a plus, why a guarantor if you have a good job, one might think?

        An extra deposit outside the standard warranty is not possible. Rules are rules, creative solutions are not really familiar to the civil service. I wouldn't make that kind of creative proposal, soon you will meet a decision official who thinks 'what a strange proposal, is there something behind this?'.

        Without further inspection it is difficult to see what went wrong. On the whole it may be clear that the rejection was absurd, but where could the application have been better? Was the presentation such that the official in KL who received the passport and papers sent to KL via BKK could estimate in a few minutes what kind of meat they had in the tub? Not too few papers (proof of job), not too many (a truckload of papers so that people can or want to give this a cursory glance), options for verification (company contact info). The notes from the front desk at BKK also count, they note what they noticed about the application and such an impression will also be taken into account. If such a note boils down to 'I don't believe the story that she travels up and down for business' then you already start with 0-1 behind..

        There are no quotas for rejections, and rejects a few percent per year (1-4%) and some of them are junk applications where half of the documents requested are missing, visa shoppers or other junk that smells bad. There are also undoubtedly bona fide people among them who have been completely overwhelmed (applicants sometimes screw up their applications because things turned out differently than they had envisioned). The basic principle is that bona fide travelers are welcome, although they are now very strict that the file must fully comply with the checklist and nothing may be missing. So that probably went wrong here and that is downright sad for Noon.

        See also https://www.thailandblog.nl/visum-kort-verblijf/afgifte-schengenvisums-thailand-loep-2016/

  2. Daniel VL says up

    Roel, thank you for this story. You have made me melancholy and increased my homesickness for home. They'll just have to wait until next year, I think May. I think what you write about your daughter is more than normal; If you want the mother, you just have to take the daughter. I also know it is easier when the children are still young, when they are a bit older they already have their own phrase. At first I thought the other girl (lady) was a friend of your daughter. It's a shame that people only know and apply the rules for those services. The young lady will survive, but she did have a dream that was shattered; Her hope was to get to know the Netherlands with a guide like you.
    I enjoyed the story
    I await the continuation of the last paragraph
    Thank you Daniel;

  3. fred says up

    You can't make head or tail of all those visa troubles. Incomprehensible couples easily get a multiple for 4 years and other serious couples get bone... you need luck .. no more and no less.

  4. Khan Peter says up

    I don't think it's right to draw conclusions based on one side of the story.

  5. Rob V says up

    Dear Roel, is Hamburg or possibly even Düsseldorf a bit of a drive from Groningen? Amsterdam is also not around the corner and, especially during the busy season, there is understaffing at the border guard (KMar) and security. Perhaps you will prefer Thailand-Germany as a flight route next time? It is no problem for a NL Schengen visa.

    This spring was pretty doable if you ask me, and many Thais take the slightly lower temperatures for granted as long as it is dry and there is something to see or do. It reads that you enjoyed it again and your family is also happy to see you. Having a good time together, that's how it should be. 🙂


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