Scenario for the death of Dutch expats in Thailand
Many Dutch people who reside permanently in Thailand are already elderly. It is therefore good to think about things when you are no longer there, such as inheritance. Ultimately, you also want your (Thai) partner to be well looked after.
Another important point of attention is that several formalities have to be completed in the event of a death. A particularly useful scenario has been written for this purpose. This script has been published by the Dutch Association Pattaya. Because Thailandblog has a somewhat larger readership, I asked the NVP, through Dick Koger, whether Thailandblog could publish the script on its website. The editors of Thailandblog have received permission for this.
The scenario is available in both Dutch and English. At the very bottom of the text is a link where you can download the script (also the English version). It may be good to discuss this with your partner, so that he/she also knows how to act in the event of a sudden death.
With thanks to the NVP and the author of the script.
Scenario for the death of Dutch expats in Thailand
The death of a partner, family member or close acquaintance is always a poignant matter. Below are advice on how to act in this case. The process is fairly simple, but it takes some time and expense. The consular department of the Dutch embassy almost immediately recommends using the services of a specialized funeral director, but these services are expensive. You can do it yourself in most cases.
The process is described in 10 chapters:
- Death at home, police report, death certificate, euthanasia
- Death in a hospital or elsewhere outside the home
- The Dutch embassy & the transport release certificate
- Transport in Thailand and cremation or burial in Thailand
- Transport to the Netherlands
- Insurance
- Will & settlement will
- Formalities in the Netherlands
- Overview documents
- Names and addresses
Chapter 1. Death at home
When you, or a doctor, have discovered the death, the nearest police station should be notified as soon as possible. Then the police arrive to find that there is apparently no crime involved. A report is generated. In any case, the police will need the passport of the deceased. A day later, the (free) police report can be picked up at the station. Make sure that the name is correctly stated in the report and that you get the passport back!
The body of any foreigner who dies in Thailand at home (or in a private hospital, or elsewhere outside the home; see Chapter 2) goes to the Forensic Department of the Bangkok Police Hospital. The local police arranges this transport, usually through the (free) services of the local Sawang Booriboon Foundation.
With the police report and passport you then go to the town hall/City Hall to obtain a (free) death certificate. Here too: make sure that the name is stated correctly and that you get the passport back! Please note: this deed mentions the suspected cause of death; the after autopsy established cause of death is only stated in the report of the Forensic Department (see below).
Make several copies of the passport, police report, and death certificate, and get one certified translation of the death certificate in English – important for many other notifications. (For certification see chapter 10.)
When the Forensic Department has established that it was a natural death (as a rule, an autopsy takes place within 2 days), the remains are released for cremation or burial in Thailand, or for transport to the Netherlands. An 'autopsy report' is also provided (see below).
NB: The treatment of the body in the Forensic Department is correct and extremely simple, but quickly gives the impression to outsiders of being disrespectful. You can have the body shown, eg to relatives who have flown over. Take care first clothing of the deceased. For a fee of (currently) 500 Baht, the staff takes care of cleaning and dressing the body.
Important!: To be able to pick up the body is one transport release ticket (in Thai) required from the consular section of the Dutch embassy in Bangkok (free). See chapter 3. This can – for good reasons, see below – take some time.
After receiving the transport release ticket, go (possibly immediately after the embassy visit) to the Forensic Department of the Police Hospital. The entrance is on Henri Dunant Road, not far from Rama I Road (behind Siam Square). Have a Thai helper with you as no one speaks English!
In addition to the transport release ticket, you will need the Thai death certificate and passport. (And also your passport, if you are named in the transport release ticket!)
The Forensic Department is providing an autopsy report in Thai detailing the actual cause of death is mentioned. For this you must (mandatory) pay several thousand Baht (approx. 5000 Baht at the moment). Make a copy of the autopsy report because it may be needed later (with a certified & legalized translation) for the estate!
With the Embassy's Transport Release Document (and the other documents mentioned), the body can be released to you for onward transport. Get the transport release document & other documents back!
If not already done: provide clothing for the deceased. For a fee of 500 Baht today, the staff takes care of cleaning and dressing the body. For further transport see chapters 4 & 5.
In summary, in the event of death, 7 documents are important for further actions:
- The passport of the deceased
- The police report
- The death certificate of the municipality/City Hall (Thai)
- The certified translation into English of the Thai death certificate
- The Embassy's transport release slip, required for any transport
- The autopsy report from the Forensic Department (or state hospital) – needed for wills etc
- A will (see Chapter 7)
In documents, always state the surname first, then the first names = exactly the same as what is in your passport, and do so in capital letters (because Thai officials often make mistakes); also make sure that the Thai 'translation' of the Dutch name is always the same!
Euthanasia
In the Netherlands, euthanasia in an inhuman or hopeless situation is regulated by law; not in Thailand. A Dutch codicil is therefore of no value here. Doctors in Thailand want to give their point of view individually, but there is no certainty. In this case, one must therefore either make an appointment with a doctor or ensure that, if necessary, transport of the person concerned to the Netherlands for euthanasia is arranged. However, see the appendix 'Disposition of Death for Medical Treatment' which is accepted in principle by every hospital because it is based on the Thai National Health Act, Art. 12, Part 1, 20 March 2550.
Chapter 2. Death in a hospital or elsewhere outside the home
If the person concerned has died in a private hospital, the same procedure follows as in Chapter 1. If the person concerned has been in a state hospital for several days and has died there, the body need not be sent to the Forensic Department in Bangkok.
In that case, the doctor of the state hospital provides a death report (combination of police report & autopsy report) with which one must report to the town hall/City Hall within 24 hours, where the official death certificate is then issued. However, for cremation or burial in Thailand, or for transport to the Netherlands, the transport release certificate from the embassy is required (see chapters 1 & 3).
The body is not released by the hospital until all bills have been paid by the insurance company or by a next of kin. See also Chapter 3, 'NB'.
In the case of a crime, it can take a while before the remains are released; the question of debt must first be addressed. This is also the case in the event of a fatal accident outside the home; the body is then taken to the nearest state hospital, and from there (sometimes directly) to the Forensic Department in Bangkok (see Chapter 1).
Chapter 3. The Dutch Embassy & the Transport Release Document
Regardless of where the death occurred, the consular section of the Dutch Embassy in Bangkok must be notified immediately (see Chapter 10). First by telephone, later by a visit to the embassy to obtain the important (free) transport release document. This document is required for the release of the body by the Forensic Department and for any transport of the body in Thailand, for cremation or burial, or for transport to the Netherlands.
Go to the embassy in Soi Tonson, Ploenchit Road (= near the intersection with Wittayu/Wireless Road). Bring the passport and the death certificate + the certified translation (and your own passport too!).
Look after: The passport of the deceased is invalidated on the spot by the embassy by making large punch holes in it (hence: first make copies of the passport yourself to have legible copies!).
Important: The consular section of the embassy can only issue the ticket directly to you if you can prove (by means of legal documents) that you are the legal partner of the deceased (eg by marriage certificate or partnership contract or other recognized document), or a family member. All these options hereinafter referred to as 'legal relationship'.
The following is important for obtaining the transport release certificate from the embassy: For a deceased person without a legal relationship in Thailand, the embassy is obliged to notify the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in The Hague of the death. The embassy may then require the certified English translation of the death certificate to be legalized by the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs (see chapters 9 & 10). Legalization gives the translated document the same authorized legal status as the original Thai document.
Family members are then informed via the Dutch Ministry of Foreign Affairs (if there are any; it is advisable to also provide the name, address and telephone number of these family members), and this may take some time, partly due to time differences.
If no one in the Netherlands claims the remains, this will be reported to the embassy, which entitles the embassy to authorize the cremation or burial of the body in Thailand and issue the transport release document to you. This process can take some time, also due to time difference and availability of relatives.
Discuss this with the consular department as soon as possible to speed this up. The embassy can waive a legalized translation of the obituary and accept that you send scanned documents by email. Of course, you must provide the original documents when you visit the embassy later.
NB: If there are no Thai or Dutch next of kin, and if others do not bear the costs, then all further matters will be arranged by the embassy (in Bangkok). The embassy may request your cooperation for further settlement.
Chapter 4. Transportation in Thailand for cremation or burial
The transport release document from the Dutch embassy is required for any transport in Thailand and for the cremation or burial. See chapter 3. The temple or church is the last agency to use (and keep!) this document.
You must arrange your own transport from the Forensic Department in Bangkok. Personnel from the Sawang Booriboon Foundation in Pattaya can provide this, but now against payment of (currently) approx. 8,000 Baht, including the usual, rather plain, white-and-gold box. Transport can also be arranged on site with the Forensic Department (not really recommended). Transport is by pick-up truck. You can of course also opt for more expensive transport by ambulance.
To arrange the cremation/burial, go to a local temple/church. You report to the abbot/rectory. A 'master of ceremonies' will be appointed to arrange the cremation/burial with you. The temple/church will need the embassy's transport release document in order to cremate or bury the body.
As a rule, the 'transport box' is temporarily replaced by a nicer 'extendable' copy with cooling before the display in the temple/church. Of course you can arrange flowers, possibly music, and other matters yourself, but in practice it is advisable to make your wishes known to the master of ceremonies. He knows how these matters can best be arranged.
Deliver a large photo with frame (minimum A4) of the deceased to the temple/church asap; it is placed near the box. In a temple, it is customary to have four to nine monks say cremation prayers at 19:00 PM for three evenings. Each time, after this ritual, some flowers and an envelope with money are offered. After these prayers, holy water is poured into a plate by the master of ceremonies every time. There are similar rituals in a church.
On the day of the cremation arranges the master of ceremonies a simple meal for the number of monks who will perform the service. This meal is at 11:00 AM (the time for the last daily meal for demons).
A paper flower with a candle is provided to the attendees during the prayers; later they are placed on/in the coffin at the crematorium. When demons have finished reciting the prayers, flowers and an envelope of money are presented by the guests to all the monks. This is also the time when a possible speech can be given.
At the end of the service, the body of the refrigerated coffin is placed in the simple white-and-gold coffin. The master of ceremonies arranges the bearers of the coffin. These can be acquaintances of the deceased, or temple helpers. Optionally, the coffin can be walked around the crematorium three times, but the coffin can also be placed directly on the platform of the crematorium. If the box is in front of the oven, the Thai custom can be followed to place robes there that are later given to demons.
The master of ceremonies opens the coffin, and the guests walk past the coffin and place the paper flower with candle in it. The box can also be kept closed. It is also possible that the box is first slid into the oven and that the guests walk past the oven. Demons again recite prayers, after which they are presented with the robes and an envelope of money.
Afterwards you can have a drink/eat on the spot, or you can go to an occasion with the guests to talk and give the guests the opportunity to express their condolences. There is nothing wrong with going straight home.
The day after the cremation, you go to the crematorium with a cotton or linen white cloth plus urn to receive the ashes and some bones of the remains. Collection is done by the master of ceremonies. It is not uncommon for some monks to say prayers and then receive flowers and an envelope. There are also other options that the master of ceremonies can inform you about.
You can do whatever you want with the urn. Some scatter the remains at sea, others take the urn to the homeland of the deceased, and still others place the urn at home. The target price for such a cremation is (currently) around 50.000 Baht (count on a minimum of 25,000 Baht).
In the envelopes that are given to demons a few times after the prayers, an amount of 2 to 300 Baht is put.
Chapter 5. Transport to the Netherlands
The repatriation procedure takes about a week. There are funeral directors who have experience to provide this transport. Consult the embassy. The company provides the prescribed embalming and a zinc-lined coffin. With the death certificate and the transport release certificate from the Dutch embassy, the company collects the body from the Forensic Department, where it also receives the autopsy report (make sure you receive a copy).
The company provides a certificate of embalming and can, if desired, arrange transport with the airline. The total costs of this are very high. One could therefore also choose to send the urn.
Chapter 6. Insurance
Many tourists (but also quite a few expats) will have a travel– or have accident insurance that reimburses part or (rarely) all costs of death. A few will even have a 'death insurance'. (Provide such details as part of your will!)
With permanent insurance, as a rule, you do not receive an annual policy; proof of payment is then the only thing to hold on to. As a rule, expats will not be covered in the event of death in Thailand if deregistered in the Netherlands.
Check whether there is insurance and contact the insurance company. If that's not immediately possible, keep expenses moderate, keep all receipts, and check the deceased's papers later to see if there's any coverage.
Repatriation of the body (to the Netherlands) is by far the most expensive. Some insurers cover these costs, often on the condition that they are immediately notified of the death. As a rule, they then also determine which service provider should be used (funeral director, airline).
Chapter 7. Will & Settlement Will
Please note that all transactions requiring the signature and/or presence of the deceased are no longer possible. That sounds obvious, but few people take this into account in advance.
As part of arrangements for a will, it is recommended that you contact the Thai bank manager to discuss what arrangement is possible to prevent Thai (or other) relatives from running out of money.
Release of property to next of kin/heirs depends on whether or not a will exists in Thailand (or in the Netherlands). Without a valid Thai will, the Thai authorities will make decisions about the assets (via a court decision, usually takes about 3 months). This can cause problems for the surviving relative(s).
Making a will in Thailand is easy. A written document in your own language or in Thai, with your own signature and the signatures of two witnesses, is sufficient. Before the court, a will must be certified to be translated into Thai (see Chapter 10).
It is recommended to engage a Thai certified notary public to make a will (see chapter 10). This has standard examples, knows what should be in a will, and witnesses are present at the office. In addition to naming heirs, the will can also indicate whether you want to be cremated or buried in Thailand. Of course also the name of the 'executor testamentary' (= the one who has to execute the last will).
If there is a recognized partner, a 'last living will' is desirable, which also indicates that the survivor can use the house, bank accounts and the like. Without a registered partner, only the executor or attorney can make necessary payments.
It is possible to make a Dutch will valid in Thailand. Have a certified translation made into English for this purpose in the Netherlands, and have this translation translated here certified into Thai (see Chapter 10).
It is recommended to always use your own name and address more that of a good acquaintance in Thailand with you. This way someone can always be warned. The location of keys, code of the safe, pin codes and matters such as the access procedure for the computer should also be left (eg sealed) with the partner or a reliable third party.
The executor of the will is responsible for the settlement of the estate. In Thailand: if desired, consult the lawyer who drew up the will. In the Netherlands: further instructions can be obtained via the internet and notary, tax authorities/advisor.
Chapter 8. Formalities in the Netherlands
Notice of death should be sent as soon as possible to all kinds of authorities, such as:
- The municipality in which the deceased lived (if not deregistered). If unsubscribed, send notification to the Municipality of The Hague via form www.denhaag.nl/ (the link says 'marriage certificate' but the form is also for registering the death certificate).
- Pension funds (private pension funds and the Social Insurance Bank for AOW) and life insurers
- Health insurance companies
- Banks in Thailand & the Netherlands
- Credit card companies
- tax authorities
- Former employer(s)
- Etc
Check the deceased's papers (and wallet) to see if more is needed; bank statements as well. Make sure you have the citizen service number of the deceased.
It is best to send a certified letter to all organizations enclosing the certified translation of the death certificate plus a copy of the invalidated passport.
For those who are registered in the Netherlands, the civil registry may require a certified-translated death certificate legalized by the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Given the effort & costs, it is advisable to wait with this authentication until this request is received. This can also be done at the Thai embassy in the Netherlands.
Chapter 9. Documents
The following documents are important:
Passport of the deceased: required for all other main documents (and for notifications in the Netherlands to various authorities); make copies, because the passport is immediately invalidated and made illegible by the embassy. Legible copies may be required later, eg for the Thai court and the settlement of the will.
Police report of the death: is available the day after the police were notified of the death. Needed to obtain the death certificate from City Hall/Town Hall.
City Hall/town hall death certificate: is made directly on the basis of the police report and passport. Make copies!
Certified English translation of the Thai death certificate: is required for notifications to the Dutch embassy and all kinds of authorities in the Netherlands, such as civil status, tax authorities, insurance companies, SVB and pension companies, etc. Make copies!
Transport clearance certificate from the Dutch embassy in Bangkok: is necessary to collect the body for further transport, eg for a temple or church in Thailand, or for the transport of the body to the Netherlands.
Autopsy report from the Bangkok Forensic Department: is required for cremation, burial or transport to the Netherlands. Make copies!
will: is recommended for a smooth settlement of the estate. Can be made both in Thailand and in the Netherlands (in Thailand preferably at a 'certified notary public'). Leave a sealed copy with your partner or a trusted friend!
Legalization of documents may be required for certain legal actions. For originally Thai documents, this is provided in Thailand for a fee by the Legalization Department of the Department of Consular Affairs of the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs (see Chapter 10) and in the Netherlands via the Thai embassy, based on a (earlier) certified translation in English. May be required for City Hall death certificate and Forensic Department autopsy report.
Chapter 10. Names and addresses
Pattaya City Hall
North Pattaya Road (between 3r & 2nd Road)
The department that handles the death certificate is on the front left, 1e floor
Dutch embassy
15 Soi Tonson, Ploenchit Road (not far from the intersection with Wittayu/Wireless Rd)
Lumpini, Pathumwan, Bangkok 10330
Tel: + 66 (0) 2 309 5200
Fax + 66 (0) 2 309 5205
Email: [email protected]
The Dutch embassy has a 24-hour telephone line, only intended for extremely urgent matters: 01-8414615
Police Hospital in Bangkok
(The Forensic Department is on Henri Dunant Road):
Police Hospital
492/1 Rama I Road,
Patumwan, Bangkok, 10330
Tel. 02 2528111-5 and 02 2512925-7
Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Department of Consular Affairs
123 Chaeng Watthana Road, Pakkret Bangkok 10120 (not far from Don Muang)
Tel: 0-2575-1056-59 Fax: 0-2575-1054
Service hours: 08.30 – 14.30 hrs. (Closed Saturday, Sunday, Public Holidays)
Email: [email protected]
(If you have not yet certified your Thai document into English, then to the left of the building – in the Soi – are several open-air translation agencies, which also charge the same amount as here in Pattaya.)
Funeral director in Thailand for transport to the Netherlands
Consult the consular section of the embassy in Bangkok for more information.
Lawyer office in Pattaya
Lawyer Mr Premprecha Dibbayawan, also for certified translations Thai-English vv (he is Certified Notary Public and Registered-Qualified Translator of the Ministry of Justice)
62/292-293 Thepprasit Road, Pattaya, in the back of the orange & green shop houses; enter either in the middle of the shop houses and turn left, or enter via Soi 6 and turn left. The office is at the end of the road. Tel. 038 488 870 through 73 Fax 038 417 260 Email: [email protected]
Law Firm in Pattaya
Miss Choolada Sae-Lau
437/112-3 Yodsak Centre, Soi 6 Pattaya Beach Road, Pattaya City
Tel 038 429343
Fax 038 423649
Law firm in Bangkok
McEvily & Collins
mr. Marcus Collins (a Dutchman)
Two Pacific Place, Suite 1106
142 Sukhumvit Rd
Bangkok 10110 Thailand
Phone: (66-2) 305-2300 (Office)
Phone: (66-2) 305-2302 (Direct)
Fax: (66-2) 653-2163
E-mail: [email protected]
www.legalthai.com
Certified translations in Bangkok
Advance Academy Thai Art Building, 4th Floor
8/9-11 Ratchadapisek Road, Klongtoey Bangkok 10100
Project Director: Wanida Sornmanapong. Thai-English, English-Thai; Dutch-English, English-Dutch; Dutch-Thai, Thai-Dutch. Also Chinese, Japanese, French, German and Italian
ANNEX May 2010 Form of disposition of property upon medical treatment
If you do not want to be kept alive at all costs in a hopeless and inhumane situation, you can fill in the form below. The applicable law is the Thai National Health Act, Art. 12, Part 1, dated March 20, 2550. For Bangkok Hospital Pattaya: Delivery Monday to Friday between 10.00am and 12.00pm to Dr. Iain Corness at Bangkok Hospital Pattaya. The latter then ensures that the patient card receives a note that shows what the patient ultimately wants. Text of the form:
Full Name: …………………………………. Hospital ID number: ……………………………………
Address: …………………………………………………………………..
Passport Number: ………………………………………………………
Being of sound mind and understanding all the implications, I ask that this document be brought to the attention of any medical facility in whose care I happen to be, and to any person who may become responsible for my affairs. This is my 'Living Will' stating my wishes in that my life should not be artificially prolonged, if this sacrifices my Quality of Life.
If, for any reason, I am diagnosed as being in a terminal condition, I wish that my treatment be designed to keep me comfortable and to relieve pain, and allow me to die as naturally as possible, with as much dignity as can be maintained under the circumstances. As well as the situation in which I have been diagnosed as being in a terminal condition, these instructions will apply to situations of permanently unconscious states and irreversible brain damage.
In the case of a life-threatening condition, in which I am unconscious or otherwise unable to express my wishes, I hereby advise that I do not want to be kept alive on a life support system, nor do I authorize, or give my consent to procedures being carried out which would compromise any Quality of Life that I might expect in the future.
I ask that you are sensitive to and respectful of my wishes; and use the most appropriate measures that are consistent with my choices and encompass alleviation of pain and other physical symptoms; without attempting to prolong life. Being of sound mind at the time of making this declaration, I ask that you will follow my wishes. It is my conviction that Quality of Life must be the main consideration for all decisions, not length of life.
In witness hereof, I have signed this document, which has also been signed by two witnesses, who have read and understand my wishes.
Declared by: ………………………………Signature:
Phone number: …………………………… Email address: ………………………………………..
Witness signatures: 1 2
Witness names: 1 ………………………………….. 2 ……………………………………..
Date (day/month/year): …………………………………………
Footnote: Refer to the Thai National Health Act, Art. 12, Part 1, dated March 20, 2550.
Editorial postscript:
Do you want to download the script as a Word document? You can do that here: Scenario-in-the-decease-of-NL-expats-in-Thailand.doc
Well I had to pick up my son in Suratthani
he lay in the temple for 3 days and someone had to be there day and night
we had to provide food for the monks ourselves
and the box is no longer opened to put anything in it
and paper flower with candle
I never had a transport document from the embassy.
there was also never a master of ceremonies present
my son was cecrematized on koh samui 10 months ago
so this story doesn't make sense because that's not how it goes
you have to take care of and pay for everything yourself
Riekie, your case turned out differently.
First of all, if your son died in prison by Suicide, then of course there are other rules that are followed.
Secondly, what is stated in the article is a script as it should be in normal circumstances, deviations are always possible, such as in your case.
that you had to pay for food for the monks yourself, is indeed not mentioned, but it is certainly normal, did you not receive a flower with a candle? maybe you should have asked for it, but beware it also costs money, no master of ceremonies? be happy because that too would have cost money.
the article nowhere says that you don't have to arrange anything yourself, it explicitly says that you have to arrange a lot. I really don't want to lose weight, but I do think you shouldn't blame everything on others.
This message does not comply with the rules you set. I would like to suggest that you delete this message.
This is private, man/woman, and I even read it as a kind of reproach to the writer. This will harm someone.
Keep the quality of this blog high, this does not belong on this Blog.
Riekie chooses to respond and someone else responds to it, you can expect that. I don't see any impermissible things in the response to Riekie.
A nice scenario, but the headline of the article is not correct, because an expat temporarily stays abroad, an emmigrant permanently. Of course, a different choice can be made later, so that the expat still decides to settle permanently or the emmigrant returns after all. But purely according to the definition, an expat does not permanently settle outside the Netherlands. 😉 Dutch pensionados in Thailand will therefore mostly be emmigrants.
You're right. The immigrants (retirees) in Thailand often call themselves expats, but that is factually incorrect.
An expatriate or expat for short is someone who temporarily resides in a country with a different culture than the one with which he grew up. They are usually sent out by their employer. They should not be confused with immigrants.
Due to the many foreigners who reside in Thailand, there is hardly any difference between an expat and an immigrant. Deployed expats are known as short-stayers, while immigrants are known as long-stayers.
The script therefore applies to both categories.
By the way, I am a long-term resident, but no matter how you look at it, I am not here in Thailand forever, so only temporarily!
This is an in-depth topic, which I have a few questions about, but will do so in parts.
1e If I die here in Thailand where I live permanently and am therefore very happily married to my Thai wife, I do not want my family and sons to be informed in the Netherlands that I have died.
The answer from Foreign Affairs via the embassy in Bangkok:
“From: BAN-CA
Sent: Wednesday, 8 February 2012 15:44
Dear Mr Mali,
Your explicit wish can be passed on to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. The DCM/CA department is the body that contacts family in the Netherlands. The embassy never does this itself.
If you expressly wish to record this, please provide me with a letter with the necessary attachments that can be forwarded to DCM/CA.
Best regards,
Cornelius Wing
Senior consular officer
So when I sent the data I got the following response:
“Dear Mr Mali,
My colleague was under the impression that a list of such requests was kept in The Hague. However, this is not the case. Your request can therefore not be executed.
My apologies for this misunderstanding.”
When I wrote that it is crazy that you cannot decide for yourself what should happen when you die, I received the following answer:
“I hope you understand that the ministry cannot keep a database with the wishes of the many Dutch people who have voluntarily settled abroad, about what should happen after their death.
I advise you to record your wish in Thailand with a notary (as is also customary in the Netherlands) and to give your wife a copy for safekeeping.
She can then inform the embassy about your wish after your death.
Yours sincerely,"
Perry Berk
DCM/CA
In other words if you don't want your family to be notified, then you need to go to a lawyer here and have this documented,
With this legal proof, your Thai wife can contact the Embassy in Bangkok and send it to the Embassy.
However, the question is how quickly will the Embassy respond based on your personal wishes or will they ignore it and simply follow the standard procedure and still inform your family?
In my opinion, you cannot stop informing first-degree relatives in the event of death, because of the settlement of inheritance rights
I even think that this is mandatory and that the deceased cannot have anything recorded about this.
He can have it recorded who should definitely be notified, but excluding family in the first degree is not possible in my opinion, no matter how bad the relationship is.
My brother passed away a few years ago in Kalasin. His body has not been transferred to the police hospital in Bangkok.
The police have made a report (to protect the doctor and the family from any prosecution on my part) and the clinic where he died gave me a death certificate stating the cause of death.
I should have had a death certificate drawn up at the aumpher (district office), but I didn't know this and apparently the family my brother was staying with didn't either.
The death certificate has been translated into English, legalized by the Thai authorities and by the embassy. In the Netherlands I registered a death.
My brother was cremated in Kalasin and I brought an urn with some bones to the Netherlands for the family.
It must be all my fault, but I can't worry about what happens after I die.
Provided> I don't live permanently in Thailand yet, only part of the year, unfortunately.
On a bank account of my girlfriend in Thailand there is a fairly large amount, for years > and no, she has never withdrawn anything, for the costs of my cremation there etc, if I die there (the remainder is for her)
I have neither child nor crow, nor any family in the Netherlands, so I owe nothing to anyone else
If I go off the pipe there, she doesn't have to inform anything or anyone about me….
She cannot withdraw anything from the account where my salary etc, and hopefully in the future my AOW and my two accrued pensions are deposited. I assume that if no body hears from me for months / years, the deposits will be stopped and then it will turn out that I am no longer there, at least not on this planet.
I myself understand very, very little of this long story. So let it all come to me
My wife will (hopefully) receive the small post-existing pension from the metal from me.
When I applied for my state pension at the SVB in Roermond, it was recorded on the papers.
Could have done that myself monthly.
This is very handy and comes right on time, not that I was planning to go yet, but I was just starting to sort this out, so no need anymore.
Thank you .
I am Andre Nederpel and I emigrated to Thailand 16 years ago.
I made a paper that says everything in our account goes to her.
We have a joint account so we can both withdraw the money.
Is this paper enough, written in Dutch and translated into Thai by a
certified translation agency in Patong.
It also states that I want to be cremated in Thailand.
Thanks in advance for this information, but I think it will be difficult for a Thai to perform all these actions.
What a wonderfully helpful article this is! It is very clear, systematic, and very complete with even the addresses and telephone numbers of the various authorities. Thanks to the Ned. Association Pattaya and the editors of this Thailand blog. This is very helpful to me, because I am sure that my relatives will need this script very badly, once the time has come that I will involuntarily leave the Thai paradise and exchange it for the other one. My daughter in NL is my executor, so this information is very useful to her, but my Thai girlfriend does not speak and read English very well. I would therefore like to have this script translated into Thai, so that she knows exactly what to do after my death. That is in MY interest. So the question travels:
Am I the only one who wants to have a Thai translation made of this, or are there more candidates who want this too? Maybe we can share the costs of the translation together and maybe even post that Thai translation on this blog?
Just respond.
I certainly want to participate in that, you see that there is really a lot of interest in this and rightly so, no one can escape this, and it is not an easy subject, a very good story that everyone can use
just let us know how and what we can do to translate this
I'm still waiting to see if more enthusiasts will come. Then I will report back to this blog. Thank you.
Thank you very much, I am happy with the information. I do not intend to go, but it is good to discuss this with my partner and Dutch friends.
Funny that several people respond with the comment, I'm not planning to go, but we're all going, that's for sure and then the information is very useful for many.
I have the following question: paid with in Thailand also tax on an inheritance? because no one is talking about that, I would like to know
Well Peter is don't push anything to others
we had to prepare the food ourselves
We also provided the flowers ourselves
We were not asked for a master of ceremonies
not even to my daughter-in-law who is Thai
I even had to do everything for 3 weeks to get a death certificate
So don't say I blame everything on someone else
the embassy did nothing just came up and down quickly
Little correction Peter
the embassy has passed it on to the authorities in the Netherlands
I didn't have to arrange that myself
Thanks for the very useful information. Would you please indicate the link to the ENGLISH TEXT again? I couldn't find it.
Many thanks and continued success
I still haven't been able to find the English text. At “download” only the DUTCH TEXT appeared for me, NOT THE ENGLISH TEXT.
Would appreciate it if you could give me some advice.
Anton Smithendonk.
The English text simply follows AFTER the Dutch text in the same Works document. You cannot download it separately.
I am very happy with this article, which contains many very important tips.
Now it is important to find a good and recognized notary office to record everything. Unfortunately, there is none to be found in Hua Hin and the surrounding area.
If anyone knows of a good and recognized notary's office, I'd be happy to recommend it. Thank you in advance
Thanks for the info and all the additions.
I have arranged the following for myself:
I recently went to the Netherlands to handle my affairs there.
For my private life I went to a notary's office and had 2 documents drawn up there. First, a new will so that the old will lapses (in connection with a break in relations with a number of Dutch people in the Netherlands and elsewhere).
In addition, in consultation with the civil-law notary, I have had a shortened version of the living will drawn up in which my girlfriend is regarded as the authorized representative in the unlikely event that I am no longer able to make my last will known.
Here in Thailand I will have it translated so my girlfriend can help me.
In the will, she and her immediate family are named as heirs. Also included is my wish to be cremated in Thailand.
I had these documents drawn up when it became clear to me that I should expect little from the embassy. It is also important to me that my loved ones here in Thailand can go through the usual grieving process. I am not married or cohabiting and in that case the embassy would have my body, but not my corpse! .