Did Thais Invent Lying?
Who regularly in Thailand come or live there will no doubt be surprised that Thais lie so easily. Why is that and is there a reason for that?
Lying is a rather bad trait in our society that doesn't really help your popularity. It is even, according to our Christian standards and values, one shame which is equivalent to stealing, for example.
You may think that Thais have a questionable mentality because they lie easily. But that is not the case. The Thai use lies to avoid conflict, something that stems from Thai culture
Prevent conflicts
Thais find it acceptable to lie to avoid conflict. They feel it is better to lie than to hurt or insult someone. A Thai does not see a lie as reprehensible, but more as a tool to prevent problems.
There is even a Thai proverb that, roughly translated, says, “If a lie can prevent you from hurting someone, then a lie is better than the truth.”
You may find that strange or hypocritical, but remember that Thai people also find many aspects of our culture difficult to understand.
Loss of face and honor
A Thai attaches great importance to preventing "loss of face". Loss of face equals the loss of honor and self-esteem, something that is one of the most important aspects of life for a Thai. In fact, the aspect of “losing face” is so important in Thai culture that some Thais would rather die than lose face.
Thai people respect each other and do not find it necessary to criticize others. However poor a Thai may be, they are a proud people and also very nationalistic. Especially Buddhism, the Royal Family and the family are institutions through which Thais feel very connected. As an outsider, never make the mistake of criticizing this. They are so important to a Thai that you immediately lose all respect of a Thai.
Hierarchy
Thais like to stick to their own culture because they are convinced that this ensures cohesion and solidarity in Thai society. Thailand is the land of freedom. Literally understood. There are very few rules in Thailand. Due to the social structure of the hierarchical society, the rules of mutual interaction and behavior are fixed in advance and things run smoothly, despite the lack of real rules. It creates order out of chaos.
A number of important rules of conduct:
- always remain friendly and polite, do not criticize others in public;
- no raising your voice, getting angry or yelling at others;
- not wanting to disappoint anyone, trying to make others feel good;
- not showing emotions or affection in public;
- accept and respect the hierarchy in Thai society (parents and teachers);
- let everyone in his / her worth;
- don't make a big deal out of anything (it doesn't matter – Mai Pen Rai).
Avoid disappointment
Because preventing loss of face is so important to a Thai, they will also do everything they can not to hurt or offend others. This starts with avoiding disappointments. Everything is allowed for that, including lying. Simply put: Thais lie so as not to make someone else feel uncomfortable.
A well-known cliché is the story about asking a Thai for directions. As a tourist, when you ask a Thai for directions on the street, he will always direct you somewhere, even if it is the wrong direction. He doesn't want you to be disappointed in him if he doesn't know the way. In addition, he does not want to disappoint you by saying that he does not know. We could interpret sending you somewhere as lying. The Thai see it as a form of "courtesy". You ask him for help and he doesn't want to disappoint you. That you will still be when you go completely in the wrong direction, does not matter in this case.
Alcohol and volcanic eruptions
When you consider the above, you can say that Thai must hold back at all times. Don't get angry and show no emotion, keep smiling. That usually works, until a limit is crossed. Then it erupts and Thais also turn out to have another side, namely that of extremely violent.
The combination of Thai and alcohol is therefore also a very unfortunate one. Alcohol ensures that all inhibitions are removed, the held back emotions then emerge like a volcanic eruption. Most acts of violence in Thailand are committed under the influence of alcohol and/or drugs.
Change
For a farang, we need to know some of these rules to prevent our behavior from causing serious embarrassment to a Thai. Insulting, shouting or getting angry in public is very hurtful to a Thai and can lead to far-reaching consequences. Just as a warning, a German tourist who gave a middle finger to a Thai in traffic was shot dead on the spot by the Thai.
As it suits
Thais have little problem with lying and see this as an acceptable means of not disappointing you or making you feel good. As I wrote before, there are few rules in Thailand and Thai people also want to apply the rules of conduct as it suits them. Although they didn't invent lying, they find it easy. Something that we find difficult to understand and accept according to our Western views.
Nb another interesting article about “the truth in Thailand” on this blog in English.
Nice article. Of course we already knew ...... and I never lie !!!
Most 1 fahlang thinks there are no rules.
Especially the tourist.
I am often ashamed of this one.
Owee if they can use this against 1 fahlang, then there are suddenly thousands of lines.
Never hand over your driver's license and always contact 1 lawyer immediately.
If there is something wrong with your neighbours, move as far as you can.
I have witnessed this kind of thing a few times, they can also shoot well and are most armed.
Can I immediately shoot a Thai who gives me the middle finger. because then I get busy. or is this privilege only reserved for the ever friendly, sweet, polite, cultured thais.
Ferry you have to adapt a bit 😉 You are a farang and you will remain a farang and they are only interesting if they bring a lot of money
I have the experience that not only money is important, which in my case is important for my in-laws whether you have a good character or not, in other words whether you are a good person, that's the only thing and money is secondary.
I didn't know this but this is cool
It is indeed what it is, or a cultural difference that few Western people can grasp. So I immediately thought of this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wGBl2eoz_4
A man who brings his Thai wife to his homeland and eventually it turns out that the lady also shares the bed with other men. She keeps insisting that she didn't do it, but the lie detector says otherwise... By the way, that man is also a soft-boiled egg.
Darko,
Again, this is serious fraud. That's something other than lying for your own good.
The contrast with the Netherlands is, if possible, even greater than the contrast with the West in general. I have traveled a lot and lived in many different countries, but the 'directness' in the Netherlands beats everything. It seems like all the hurt, rudeness and rudeness is justified because 'at least I'm being honest'. In other Western countries, people treat each other much less directly and more tactfully, with the closest countries being Belgium and England as an example. I see that the Dutch often have trouble with this ('turnouts, behind their elbows, hypocrites and liars' I hear) and the difference with how the Thais treat each other is an absolute nightmare for most Dutch people.
Yes indeed, not always but often that “absolute nightmare”. Keep tripping over the attitude on this blog that you should see this as a cultural difference and that one attitude is not worse than the other, just different.
But I maintain that dishonesty, insincerity, lying is wrong and annoying in every culture. Whatever cultural sauce is thrown over it and however funny and beautifully you explain it, wrong is wrong.
Just like alcoholism, aggressiveness, intolerance towards other population groups ( BKK towards Isaan ) dishonesty. You can explain everything from poverty, religion, cultural differences, they are just annoying annoying character traits that are apparently more common in some places than others.
That eternal smile and mai pen rai has long ceased to impress me, rather arouses suspicion. Trust is too often betrayed.
Experience sometimes gives the right to speak and does not always mean a negative attitude. It's not always sunshine here, on the contrary. For many people, a longer stay in Thailand (not a superficial holiday with enough money in your pocket and with your own team) means a sobering experience, disappointment and a lot of misery. No sweet Thailand fairy tale helps against that.
Thailand land full of sanouk and possibilities, but also land of extreme pitfalls and abuses,
Indeed Robbert, we are definitely the opposite. Thai Ned can't actually either. It takes even two very sincere, well-developed people an awful lot of effort to balance.
I find it very annoying for Dutch people that they do not understand the above part, so their Thai doll always lies in the beginning ( sorry ladies ) but NOT lied to his Dutch. You must forgive them and, above all, explain that we were raised differently. Yes, they really don't like our Dutch bluntness. In fact, I don't really understand what a Dutchman wants with a Thai or vice versa. I'm taking sexuality and money out of the story for now, that's irrelevant now.
Isn't it human nature to often look for the complex or the impossible?
If one says that something does not work or cannot be done, it can be a challenge for the other person to try. In addition (even if it doesn't work in the end) it must be interesting to have a relationship with someone who is completely different from you.
I'm in a relationship with a Thai beauty.
We are both around 30 years old and she works in NL and I also met her here.
Of course we are different, but I think this is a challenge. And it actually makes the relationship interesting. She is crazy about me and absolutely not after my money because she earns more than me ;) ..
I have never been so pampered by a woman!
There are so many different women and men in every country in the world.
We cannot tar everyone with the same brush. Every Thai woman is different!
How can you say that in the end it doesn't work with a Thai woman?
It's about the person. Meet a normal woman with a normal existence!
I therefore do not understand that rich old men make a very young "barmaid" from Bangkok or wherever if you are a wife, you can expect that it is only about your money, and you will only bring misery over you.
My current “thai doll” as well as my Thai ex (now best friend) have definitely never lied. Almost always in Dutch direct and very clear in what they want and what not
Because of this directness, openness and honesty, many women prefer contact with a falang to a relationship with an often unreliable macho Thai partner in their eyes. And not just about the money.
Mutual interest in each other works wonders. Thai women are often able and willing to (jointly) take care of their partner financially. Manage and often take care of the finances. Better work ethic, more reliable and more loyal than their Thai counterpart and not too bad to make an economic contribution in a good relationship with her falang.
Sometimes nothing family interests, but just your own family first.
My partner takes care of the household, child and work in his own company. 200% commitment and input. Still time and energy left for homely sanouk in the evening
“No raising your voice, getting angry or shouting at others”.
When the Thai whispers you can hear it 500 meters away, when they are angry 1000 meters away. Trust me, they can be quite verbal. I experienced it myself once.
At Mike shopping mall; looked around and stopped at a shop window with watches, etc. I said nothing or asked nothing and walked on after a few minutes. The guy - a Katoi, at least a guy in women's clothing - didn't like that very much and lashed out at me. Apparently she hadn't sold anything that day.
How in Buddha's name is it possible that such a person got such a job?
I don't mean to be lame, Sam. But in Pattaya and some other tourist centers things are a bit different….
I don't mean to be silly, editor. But I'm inclined to agree with you. My impressions are based on experiences I have had in Pattaya in particular.
Now I understand that Pattaya is not Thailand, but should be seen more as a "god and commandment-ridden enclave" in Thailand. It may indeed be different from the rest of Thailand.
I have been living in Thailand for over 13 years now, and I have never come across a Thai THAT DON'T LIE!!!
The Thai children are updated with lies early on. Greed., stingy., rude., no table manners., unreliable., discriminatory., stupid, and sometimes dangerous.
Still, I really like it here in Thailand… a beautiful country, good food, excellent temperatures… that's it! I myself am unmarried, and will / dare not marry a Thai.
The undersigned…a single parent with an 18-year-old son.
Greed., stingy., rude., no table manners., unreliable., discriminatory., stupid, and sometimes dangerous.…that's it!
Unbelievable, only for the good food, temperature and for the beautiful women that you are in Thailand, sad, is all I can say to that. I am married to a Thai woman whom I respect, and she and her family respect me, lying is also not in their dictionary because they detest it, openness and honesty is important. I have Thai friends here and they are happy that I say what I think and don't mince words, straight forward. Why always be negative, I think you just want to live on your own and want to impose your way of thinking and living habits on the Thai and do not want to share, you simply live in Thailand and not in the Netherlands or Belgium (I am Belgian myself, maybe we are more tolerant and adapt more easily than the Dutch). I live and am married in Thailand and have never had a conflict. Being positive and kind costs nothing, and love is the language of all countries.
It's great that you nuance it Francky. Apparently some people also have trouble making a distinction.
It is of course not possible that all Thais fit the image of Hans. It is the same cliché that all Dutch people are stingy and all Belgians stupid.
When you generalize like that, you should also look at yourself.
This is indeed very negative (that is also a stereotype for the Dutchman that is of course not true for everyone)..
It all comes down to the fact that every person is different. Anywhere in the world.
I think what some Westerners have trouble with is not to subconsciously look down on the Thai because he / she comes from a "poor" country. See each other as equal and respect the other. Then you will see what a huge respect you get in return.
we have cultural differences. If you have trouble adjusting to another culture, is it worth the aggravation to live in another country?
((I have already explained above my experience with my Thai girlfriend.))
I don't think it's right to put the same label on 65 million people. Are all Dutch people good or bad? That's too easy.
Hans, I could not have summed it up better myself. NB But this also applies to the Philippines.
Meazzi or Roon, is there actually anything good about Thai people? Is there really nothing and no one from the Thai? Not even children and babies?
Are you perfect yourself?
Please give a decent answer, because I'm tired of your complaining on this blog.
If your contribution consists only of whining and being negative, start a blog yourself. Then you write stories all day about how rotten the Thai are. That's a relief, I think. Another advantage is that we can get rid of your nagging.
I only mean the ladies of pleasure, kids and babies are still innocent. Good luck Uncle godfather
For the Philippines:
Do you mean lying or the enumeration of greed., stingy., rude., no table manners., unreliable., discriminatory., stupid, and sometimes even dangerous.
well hans I won't say anything more about this, because the editors have stepped on their toes. Moreover, decency is a broad concept, you can argue about that.
A little more nuance can never hurt an answer.
And don't generalize. I think that's what the editors are referring to. But if not, please correct me/complete.
Look, under the list you list, I can also rank a few compatriots.
But fortunately not every Dutchman.
I also find Hans van Mourik's comment much too general, but a number of Thai people from a certain environment will certainly fall under it.
Can't understand why the editors leave comments like this on the site. It's the same story every time, just negative petty gossip from frustrated falang who are unable to meet a nice Thai woman.
Mostly Pattaya goers. Been living in Thailand for a long time, but no Thai has ever raised his middle finger, only some farang do. And a Thai doesn't LIE but doesn't always tell the whole truth, it's something else.
Editorial; Try posting some more positive stories than this kind of post.
The text has been modified by the editors due to the use of swear words.
Dear Martin, I can imagine your frustration. I'm also tired of the negative nagging of the 'frustrated' farang. My wise mother always said: either you do something about it, or you accept it, but don't whine.
Fortunately, there are also plenty who take the trouble to highlight the other side.
A request to you, please use normal language from now on. You are doing exactly the same as the farang that detests you, behaving inappropriately.
Dear editor, I will try to restrain myself from now on. But if you have lived in Thailand for a long time like me, it is incredibly annoying that there are always a number of figures who spout such populist nonsense. And this time it was very bad what one Hans van Mourik gives in response, and a few other figures following that.
Apologies, will take a cooling-off period before responding.
Fine, apology accepted.
A Thai does not lie is of course a bit exaggerated, but I know from experience with my girlfriend that they bend the truth a bit in their own interest. And even if you ask about her past, it's always hard to find the real truth, she doesn't want to tell me something I won't like, but she basically tells the truth. But even a Thai does not always tell the same broad outlines and a bit of pluses and minuses, you eventually know what you want to know. And also often nothing is said even though you can just see / notice that there is something…… no no nothing honey…. but then patience is a virtue, when my girlfriend has processed the issue she will talk automatically and you will more or less hear what was there. Difficult to deal with sometimes but I just know that she never really flat out lies and cheats.
The Asians have a culture of shame, nothing is worse than losing your “face”. Westerners, however, are characterized by a culture of guilt, which is widely used. For example, there is currently a Third World foundation talking us into a guilt complex when we're in the shower for too long! Also in this blog you sometimes come across traces of such guilt-thinking. This mix of cultures can sometimes produce a poisonous brew if any basic knowledge is lacking. “East is East and West is West and never the twain shall meet” according to Asia connoisseur Graham Green. But that was still in a world without tourism and the internet.
What generally surprises me is the lack of insight into Asian (including Thai) thinking of the Dutch, while we have helped shape that part of the world for more than 400 years. Where has that knowledge gone?
A good response from Dirk. I just can't find the last one. Few people really understand Thai. You will have to speak at least Thai and there are not many falang who can do that
I don't think making someone feel guilty has much to do with guilt culture.
In my opinion, guilt culture has more to do with taking the blame, where you are guilty, even though someone else doesn't know that yet.
The culture of shame is more based on the principle, what doesn't know, doesn't hurt, even if you've robbed a bank.
But maybe a good subject for a topic.
rate
There is even a Thai proverb that, roughly translated, says, “If a lie can prevent you from hurting someone, then a lie is better than the truth.”
rate
And when the lie comes true, a falang feels doubly hurt.
I wonder how a Thai looks at this.
Hansy,
That's true what you write. This is due to the cultural difference. What the Thai has deemed right is absolutely wrong for the Dutchman. Bang it is then. But if you first understand very well how and why the Thai think and act, then you understand very well how it works. Suddenly you see that those lies weren't so bad after all. They came from a good Thai heart.
I'm also sure that your Thai boyfriend or girlfriend never, ever wanted to hurt you. If that person had known how it works for a Dutch person, that lie would never have existed. It is and will remain a different country, we Dutch people have to adapt. Even with things like this.
I have the impression that a Thai doesn't look ahead, it's about the now.
That's the case with almost everything, don't save, buy a lot of food now but that it won't stay good for long is of later concern, now twisting the truth but that it comes out later is not taken into account.
In principle, the intention is good, it is just difficult to understand….. we often do not understand the Belgians and that is a lot closer.
Agree, the differences in Thailand are already so great that it is difficult to draw conclusions. Even in Isan there are cultural differences per city and region. But then again, in the Netherlands you cannot tar all Zeelanders, Frisians, Limburgers, Brabanders with the same brush. It's like they all behave the same way. How short-sighted can you be to think that everyone has the same mentality.
Yes, but the question is whether they want to make the effort? It is often an expression of frustration. They are not looking for the nuance. In addition, they also have to look in the mirror. Often one triggers the other.
If everyone on this blog only responds nuanced, it might get a bit boring? “Contradictions” provoke reactions and sometimes enliven the discussion, if only we remain polite to each other.
But who am I, also just corrected by the editors for "too explicit use of words" in an innocent attempt to be clear. (no problem, all understanding).
Blog (unlike others) remains interesting.
Ferdinand, I read your comments with great interest. Like all my comments, it's one opinion not the opinion. So fine. I do try to draw a line somewhere because the choice of words to indicate something can be too explicit. You are communicatively strong enough to make that clear in another way.
As said: no problem at all. You're right, let's keep it civil. By the way, I wasn't aware of any harm, don't even remember what it was exactly, probably a slightly too clearly sexually tinted comment, which I thought fit the context..
Again, Blog is a fun and interesting collection of opinions and experiences. I think you put a lot of time and energy into this hobby, all due respect. Think many will enjoy it. Of course there are professional cancer survivors, but the majority will mean well.
In any case, I remain a reader and sometimes a commenter (with hopefully control over my use of words).
Good luck and probably on behalf of many, thanks for your effort. Thanks again for explaining the background of Khun Peter and Hans Bos
Well, let's try it then. Isaan, no bar types, but family from a reasonable environment. Talk on the market standing next to the one it's about (and also being your own family).
She tells another; the newly born child of X (who is standing next to her) (X was previously married to a falang and has now been remarried to a Thai husband for years), is from that former falang relationship. X asks surprised how can you tell such nonsense, you already know family better, don't you?
"She" answers even more surprised, "of course I know it's not true, but what's the problem, still a nice story"
Live in the Isaan for years, regardless of whether poor or rich, man or woman, whatever environment or function, lying and cheating (each other, so not just a falang) fantasizing and gossiping is a kind of second nature.
Don't say that again that is generalizing, it is an experience I have with many acquaintances, friends, family, neighbors in shops, companies, municipality etc etc.
And it is certainly not, as described in the article above, always well-intentioned and to prevent conflict (an equally generalizing and romanticized view of Thai culture) but often downright malicious and intended to harm another.
Frustrated falang? Yes sometimes ! Because I love this country and most people. As often said, cultural differences do not make everything easier. Annoying and bad character traits remain annoying in the Netherlands and Thailand.
It is a pity that on this blog it is always stated that if falang you have to adapt, it is simply different here. Lying, stealing, cheating and aggressiveness are everywhere wrong and annoying whatever cultural sauce you throw on it.
Just like in NL, despite the weather, not everything is sunshine in Thailand and Thai society has some very annoying sides such as corruption, unreliability and violence. Even if you enjoy the country and the "freedom" that we value so much (and unfortunately that doesn't apply to everyone, certainly not to the underclass) you don't always have to justify everything.
Noted said my experiences of several years in Bangkok were more positive. Education, job, etc. will have to do with that.
The story that the Thai is so peaceful and wants to avoid conflicts is also relative. Know a lot of Thais with a very short fuse, a terrible aggressive attitude if they don't get their way, no matter how unreasonable. I do not mean here in the relationship with a falang but Thai to each other.
Serious abuse within marriage, domestic violence, business disagreement or over 100 bath is very common.
It is not unusual for an (indeed often drunk) Isaner to solve his problems in or outside the home with a gun or machete. The police often respond to this with “well, as long as there are no deaths, we prefer not to interfere”
Young people of 14 years old at the vocational schools carry a gun in their pocket and often use it. Reaction of teachers on the internet, oh well we know the problem but they don't shoot us.
And respect for parents? very limited. Parents here have even less control over their children than in the west. Certainly boys have every freedom and go their own way, 13 and 14 year olds walk the streets at night, race 100 km on their moped and absolutely cannot handle criticism.
Also here in a small village. Children commit robberies and harass the elderly.
Gangs from one village wreak havoc in another, the elderly and so-called village chiefs are laughed at. 14 year old alcoholics no exception, Mom and Dad can't (or won't) do anything.
Read the Bangkok post about (gang) rapes in high schools. Boys of 14 unfortunately do not listen to parents.
Respect ?Yes girls towards their parents and grandparents. But that has more to do with oppression and abuse (in every area) than with respect.
Another negative response from a frustrated falang? no unfortunately experiences and observations from very close. And of course it does not apply to everyone and everywhere. On balance it remains very nice to live here, although you often have to create your own world, swallow and accept a lot.
But explaining all negative things on the basis of cultural differences and looking through rose-colored glasses and justifying them does not help either. Wrong is wrong.
Everyone has to take stock for themselves in their environment, and as long as it is positive, we will stay here and enjoy the (relative) freedom and often also nice people and your own relationships. In the end, we choose it ourselves.
And there are also plenty of Thais with whom you can deal openly and honestly and very frankly.
Although some things (outside your very immediate environment) remain taboo, such as Buddhism, Royal Family and long toes.
Nuanced enough?? Editors are right Thailand is not necessarily worse or better, just different. But just calling things by their name helps (sometimes) at least to relieve it.
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In the Netherlands, we also want foreigners to adapt to our customs and culture and not the other way around.
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This is assimilation, not integration, which we are all talking about.
Just look at the meanings in the dictionary.
agreed, but we are bringing money to a 3rd world country. And often the foreigners who come to NL are out to get money. And as everyone knows, money is very important.
Yes quite right. Adapt to the environment where you live. Also gain more and more understanding for the problems of Turks and Moroccans in the Netherlands.
What I meant to say, it's a pity that the editors and some writers often look through colored romanticized travel guide glasses.
Just like in NL, there are real abuses in TH. They do not always have to be justified under the guise of cultural differences.
Some things are wrong in every culture. You don't have to adapt to that. You can fight against that, especially if you care about the country and the people.
There are few Blogs about Haiti. Nobody has a problem if you don't want to adapt to the culture of violence and aggression there. More understanding is often expected for abuses in Thailand.
Corruption, aggression, abuse, unreliability, cheating and lying (even if you have such nice explanations for it) lack of work ethics (it's getting grayer here, but I could write a book about my own experiences, but I won't because there are already so many) alcoholism, violence, etc. etc. cannot be condoned by the word cultural difference. And I certainly don't want to adapt to it, at most learn to deal with it and if at all I can't make these things worse by my own attitude.
And all these mentioned things occur in Thailand, especially in Isaan (due to poverty or for whatever reason), surely a little more than under 1% of the population.? The editors as a Thailand connoisseur might agree with me?
Incidentally, I fully understand that the editors, as Thailand enthusiasts, have set themselves the goal of counterbalancing the sometimes very primary negative expressions of often “Pattaya goers” with a very one-sided image of Thailand. Otherwise there will be nothing left of this blog.
But in Thailand the sun does not always shine and in the rainy season I take off my pink sunglasses and I also see things that I, as a Falang, do not want to adapt to. A do-gooder as I apparently am as a typical Dutchman.
Incidentally, I don't feel like a Dutchman, not a European, not an Asian, just a citizen of the world and I don't want to let my understanding of good and evil be dictated by ONE local culture. Some things are universal.
Ferdinand, here too you took the words right out of my mouth. I think you do indeed have a very good idea of how the fork is in the stem. Razor-sharp analyses. Realistic, without being directly judgemental.
In addition, another commonplace. Have you ever seen a Thai handle criticism? Where “we” as “Dutch people” like to self-flagellate, a Thai does not get further than, “yes you may be right, but we have been doing it that way for years”. He smiles and continues on the same footing, especially if the criticism comes from an outsider.
The (funny?) “Mai pen rai” too often means “I don't care”
But that's a hackneyed prejudice. But one that I am expected to adapt to on a daily basis. Which works fine by the way. There are more things I don't understand in my life. And yet I go on and enjoy it.
Don't ALWAYS adapt. Sometimes I walk around it, and that is the advantage, that can probably be done better here than in NL where you MUST adapt to everything. (now I get the NL Blog all over me again?)
Lying = is difference of interpretation
What I often notice from my own relationship and experiences in the immediate vicinity is that a Thai does not "ask". If a friend or family member has called or stopped by, I often get half the story.
If you ask how exactly something is or what exactly he or she said, or how an appointment works, you usually get the answer "I don't know, he didn't say".
As a Thai, you simply don't ask questions if the other person doesn't say something on their own.
Mistake that we then make as a falang, insist further and force an answer. What happens then (satisfying, avoiding disappointment?) your partner gives his own interpretation of what happened. Something is made up just to give an answer. To lie ?
You write that you often only hear half a story.
In that case, it seems to me, information is withheld.
Or you get to hear a whole story, but little detail. Apparently the listener has had little interest in what has been said.
The person who asks about it again (that is, you in this case) will get the impression that he is only hearing half a story.
Asking questions is pointless. In our culture, when asking questions you would add that you only listened with half an ear, because you don't care that much.
Or see it wrong?
No, nothing is withheld “people” just think it's rude to ask. If the other person doesn't tell you something on his own accord, he obviously doesn't want that and you don't ask any further. This often leads to misunderstandings, because everyone then relies on their own interpretation or suspicion.
For example, an appointment with a Thai can be very uncertain, no one has inquired exactly where and when. Many agreements are “vague”.
Apart from the fact that the "W" question (why, when, who, where) is always something difficult in Thailand. It is often not understood why we are so terribly precise and nagging.
Could be my character. But every falang friend of mine knows this problem
Can I agree 100%. After a telephone conversation between my girlfriend and her parents, I sometimes ask if they had anything new or what it was about. Answer is invariably, nothing honey they always talking for the money because they care for me.
And that after a conversation of over 1 hours 🙁
I also know that it is often a long conversation about nothing, but it is frustrating that nothing is ever said about it. By now I can control myself and ask no further.
The words that I already know and that I catch in the conversation already give me an impression of the conversation that saves a lot. But I really wish that language stuck in my gray matter a little faster.... :(
Sounds very familiar to me exactly the same, an hour on the phone with mother or girlfriend and if you ask what it's about you will hear it in 1 or 2 sentences.
I used to worry about that but it's no use you don't change much about it. It's not that I'm not interested anymore, but if you ask it (too) directly you will hardly get an answer, and at a later time she will start talking about it anyway.
Ferdinand is absolutely right. By the way, don't worry too much about those long conversations. If you speak a little Thai you know that it is absolutely never about anything.
It is true that it is often about nothing….. and also that something is often said about it later.
Just got to hear the truth yesterday about something that happened a month ago… nothing serious or anything but so trivially stupid. We went with mom and dad to the market where there was a fortune teller/hand reader, I went for a nice walk with dad and she went there with mom. Then she told me that the man told her that she should be in a relationship with a white person who is older than her and that she should live abroad and get rich… and some other little things. I immediately knew it was half the truth, but I couldn't get anything out of it. Now she said he told her she was going to meet someone and I would meet someone else too when we were far apart and which is a total hoot that I would be a player a playboy and that's why I'm into something with a others would do. But they still really believe it, and then her mother didn't let her tell me, but now that she herself was in a slump because we are not together, it worked out, partly because there was such a brush on TV with the same story came when she called them. Well, that is also the story they tell every Thai girl. (marry rich foreigner and live there) nothing personal.
But well after Phom Rak Khun Maak Maak it was all ok again because she knows me well enough to know better. Phew fortune telling, how they can stress a relationship.