Long-stay expats are in turmoil over Thailand's new visa policy that makes their expensive long-term options almost worthless. The introduction of a 60-day visa waiver policy and the 180-day Destination Thailand Visa (DTV) has left many feeling shortchanged.
Geoffrey Fisher, a Brit who recently paid 900.000 baht (almost €23.000) for a five-year Elite visa, complained: “I've wasted my money because now almost anyone can stay in Thailand almost indefinitely for a paltry sum. ”
The disgruntled expats claim that the 60-day visa-free option can be extended by 30 days at local immigration offices, followed by a border check to restart the process. Reports from Suvarnabhumi Airport suggest immigration officials are telling new arrivals they can perform as many border runs as they want.
The DTV, which costs just 10.000 baht (approximately €253), gives 180 days upon entry with the option to extend for another 180 days. This process can also be repeated by briefly leaving the country.
“It's just ridiculous. I have to put 800.000 baht in a Thai bank, get health insurance, follow constantly changing rules and provide my Thai address all year round or I will be fined. And what for, if the new visas allow you to come and go as you please?” said an indignant expat.
Social media is abuzz with similar sentiments as expats process the latest visa changes. However, critics may be overreacting. Official information does not specify how often the visa-free discretion can be used. The DTV requires a cash deposit or proof of 500.000 baht and is mainly aimed at digital nomads and freelancers working for foreign companies. Applicants must show contracts or portfolios and participants in Thai soft power activities, such as cooking classes, Muay Thai training, medical treatments, music festivals or seminars, are also eligible.
An expat with a one-year extension on his Thai Marriage visa wondered: “Would a hospital appointment letter for tooth extraction give you 180 days plus a 180 day extension? Does a foreigner who takes Thai cooking classes need five years to learn to cook?”
Immigration lawyer Jessataporn Bunnag noted: “The DTV places a major responsibility on embassies to vet first-time applicants and on the immigration bureau to monitor extensions and repeats.” Jessataporn expects more clarity once the impact of the changes has been analyzed.
Source: The Thaiger
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Known as Khun Peter (62), lives alternately in Apeldoorn and Pattaya. In a relationship with Kanchana for 14 years. Not yet retired, have my own company, something with insurance. Crazy about animals, especially dogs and music.
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You can't really blame them for asking questions about that, of course. Especially with the Elite Visa.
FYI – 10 Baht indeed for a DTV, but it costs the equivalent of 000 Euro. As with any visa, there are several factors involved in the conversion other than just the exchange rate
Ronny, my calculator says 10.000 baht is about 250 euros. Saves a sip on a drink…
It's not just about the exchange rates as I said. It would indeed be a lot less…
How else do you use your calculator to explain the prices of, among other things, these visas at the Thai embassy in The Hague
Single Entry Tourist visa (SETV) = 35 Euro which is actually 1000 Baht for that visa
Multiple Entry Tourist visa (METV) = 175 Euro which is actually 5000 Baht for that visa
Non-immigrant O Single entry = 70 Euro which is actually 2000 Baht for that visa
Non-immigrant O Multiple entry = 175 Euro which is actually 5000 Baht for that visa
Non-immigrant OA Multiple entry = 175 Euro which is actually 5000 Baht for that visa
Non-immigrant OX Multiple entry = 350 Euro which is actually 10 Baht for that visa
In the Thai embassy it is a little different but similar
“It's a little different in the Thai embassy in Brussels, but it had to be comparable.”
You can also see those prices (except for a few euros) on the website of the Thai embassy in Brussels.
https://brussels.thaiembassy.org/en/page/visa-fee
I suspect that they also want to make up for some personnel costs
The latter is common: if you apply for a passport or something else at a Dutch embassy, you may also pay 60 euros more than if you pick up one in the Netherlands. Additional costs are incurred for special shipping, counters, security, more expensive housing, higher salary costs for staff posted abroad. I think the discussion about a few Euro price difference, which is very reasonable and can be argued, falls completely outside the topic at hand.
Ger Korat,
1. I initially posted that comment for information, because the article contained a conversion that was 100 Euros lower and I wanted to point that out to the reader. Which is something different than a few Euros.
2. The further reactions are directed at Hans Bos who used the exchange rate and I mean that there is more going on than just an exchange rate. I wanted to demonstrate that this is also the case with other visas and that there is only a negligible difference between The Hague and Brussels.
3. By the way, I never say that I don't think it's normal for them to ask for more.
4. Whether my response has anything to do with the topic or not is certainly not up to you to decide.
But if you think that, that's fine, ... but don't respond to it yourself. That's just stupid.
5. Another tip. If you have difficulty understanding texts, read them a few more times. Will your comments benefit…. especially if they are English texts. Prevents blunders like the one from a few days ago, but I suspect this is still on your mind because I pointed it out to you...
I recently submitted a DTV visa application and had to pay €350. Even though it is written everywhere about 10.000 THB. Strange but true.
Not strange at all as I said before.
This is in line with what the embassies also ask for other visas.
Non-immigrant OX is also 10 Baht and you also have to pay 000 Euro for it.
Most retired expats probably don't understand it anymore. Why do they still have to invest 800.000 Baht? Or why prove their place of residence and/or their (generous) income every year? Why do many people there have to submit an (OA) visa and insurance? Why do they still have to register every 90 days with a series of proofs? Why do they still need a TM30?
Why are they (probably) going to be seen as tax residents with a lot of hassle, while they may only stay here 189 days a year?
As it stands now, as a traveler you can come to Thailand for months without having to provide any proof, unlike those we call expats who use a valid visa and its extension ??
Fred
A TM30 is always required. Also if you are staying in Thailand on Visa exemption. That is a notification of arrival at an address.
Also a TM 47 if you stay more than 90 days continuously.
And we will see whether that VE is unlimited.
With a DTV you also have to prove 500 Bath.
I'm still holding on to my Non-Immigrant. I certainly don't feel like doing those border runs that aren't free, and annual renewal doesn't bother me at all.
By the way, I suspect that the last word has not yet been written on this. Officially I mean….
The DTV variant with 180 days in Thailand and upon departure abroad, this is reset for the next 180 days during the validity of the visa.
So then you are not considered a tax resident?
Can this visa also be obtained in Thailand?
Kind regards, Carlos
In principle, you should obtain a new residence period of 5 with each entry during those 180 years. This is the case with every Multiple Entry Visa.
However, this makes no difference to becoming liable for tax, as the residence in Thailand is taken into account on an annual basis, not the way in which that residence was obtained.
You can only apply for this DTV via an embassy or consulate and then via the e-visa site
Don't understand the fuss! I pay THB 1900 annually for my visa extension, I don't have 800k in the bank and I don't have to leave the country. This new visa is more expensive and on top of that there are also the costs of leaving Thailand twice a year. It is an option for those who now pay a lot to agencies to stay here.
I won't use that either as I said before.
But if you had paid, say, 1000 Bath for an Elite Visa, then that might be different and I can understand that.
I think the future will tell whether those who now use visa offices will now cheer.
“expats angry”?
They may be dissatisfied, but there is no need to be angry,
Because nothing has actually changed for them.
And if the rules are necessarily addressed, the entire travel business is satisfied and everyone benefits.
I see no reason for myself to change my way. Is Thai Marriage and it will remain so.
An hour to renew every year at 1900 Baht and you're done.
Other Visa Exemption?
Every 60 days to immigration for 30 days to be extended at 1900 Baht, then a border run to get another 60 days... as if that were free.
Then some hassle at the border post because someone there thinks you should not return the same day...
Then you no longer have a bank account because you are not a non-immigrant, or you can no longer renew your driver's license because you are not a non-immigrant, etc.
No, I thank you all for this and just do what I have been doing for years...
And I am not eligible for DTV, but it is not necessary either
But ultimately, everyone has to decide that for themselves
Yes, there are always people who have to complain about every intervention, it is simply better for the tourist and for Thailand.
The permanent resident has chosen his own solution and simply does not want it for the normal tourist.
Moderator: please stick to the topic of visas.
I don't think it matters much to the average tourist, with or without the new 60 day rule history.
Since the vast majority of tourists do not stay longer than two or three weeks.
Hibernators will benefit from this, as they often stay for several months.
What I am afraid of, especially having seen the list of the new countries to come.
That many fortune seekers and criminals will move here.
The whole new 60 day system plan, plus the possible and easy extension could be a big backfire for Thailand.
More problems with foreigners and more work for the police and IMMI police.
We'll see, I'm afraid the whole system will be reversed quickly, also because the expected increase in income for the tourist industry will not be achieved.
Jan Beute.
I don't understand 'being angry' at all. If you really want to stay in Thailand as a permanent resident, the best solution is still the Non-O, on any basis, with annual extension, still the best and cheapest solution. If you take a look at the pros and cons, you will quickly come to that decision.
All that complaining about the TM30, the annual extension, the 90d notification, the financial requirements does not outweigh the constant need to make border runs.
– TM30: must actually be done by the landlord and is not reciprocal annually, as long as you do not leave the country or return to the same address. If necessary, you do it yourself.
– 90d message: now goes online perfectly and takes 5 minutes on the computer
– financial proof: a visit to the bank, when using the 400 or 800.000 THB bank balance. When applying for an affidavit or letter of support, you do not even have to leave the house
– annual extension: go to immigration once a year and with the correct documents, it takes half an hour here and costs me 1900THB
If that's too much trouble, well then you have a very busy life here in Thailand and that as a retiree...????.
But being angry and complaining is free.