Well, that will be an escape for me. Not all Thai banks just open a (EURO) account. The Dutch pension payers also do not always want to cooperate due to the high costs. And then those exchange costs in Thailand are not nothing. And that every month. Of course if the rule is followed.
Here in Pattaya, the consul will not be happy. No more annual statements to verify and convert to an income statement for the past year. I myself have some property in Thailand, but that does not count for my extension application. Crazy right?
But there is a solution, I thought. It may not work for everyone, but still. Open a second account with your bank and deposit 65.000 baht into it and do it again the next month, both times from your other bank account with the same bank, of course. You then transfer 65.000 baht back to the first bank account and repeat this process every month. This can be automated at the bank or via internet banking.
In principle, there is always 65.000 baht fixed on the second account. The idea behind this is that you can show each year at emigration that 65.000 baht is deposited monthly. And that is the condition. You took the rest to live on and that's allowed, right?
Or am I wrong with this idea?
Submitted by Bob – Jomtien
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Dear Bob, you are wrong with this idea. If you want to prove your income by monthly deposits of 65.000 baht, the immigration announcement clearly states that the deposits must come from overseas. But I do not understand that as a Dutchman you want to follow a complicated shortcut. If you do not want or cannot deposit 800.000 or 400.000 bahy, simply use the letter of support from the embassy. It will remain valid. The Belgians can also still get an affadavit at their embassy. The immigration announcement states that this ability to prove income has been added to help those people whose embassy no longer issues income letters (USA and Australia)
I am one of the Dutch people who do not enjoy their income from Thailand or the Netherlands and therefore literally piss outside the pot. Embassy does not cooperate with income statement.
Proving my income by means of bank transfers from abroad is therefore a solution, but I am in Thailand more than 185 days a year and do not want to 'tax' myself…
An alternative, and every proposal is 1, is therefore always a welcome solution
If the Dutch embassy cannot verify your income, you always have the option of money in the bank. Plus you are one of the lucky ones who can take advantage of the new ability to prove that you receive 65k Baht (retired) or 40k Baht (married) monthly from abroad into a Thai bank account.
This has nothing to do with taxes.
Steven
The moment you stay in a country for more than 183 days on an annual basis, it is characterized as a tax resident. I don't suspect that people really pay attention to this at immigration, but for me it is a risk that I do not like to take by means of transfers from abroad to my Thai bank account
So it has everything to do with tax duty….
The foreign embassy does not cooperate because I do not have the nationality of the country in question.
I understand that there are alternatives, which I now also use, just indicate how I, as an NL-er, is not supported by the NL representation, while everything can be demonstrated through contracts, etc.
“The moment you stay in a country for more than 183 days on an annual basis, it is characterized as a tax resident. I don't suspect that people really pay attention to this at immigration, but for me it is a risk that I do not like to take by means of transfers from abroad to my Thai bank account
So it has everything to do with tax duty….”
Sorry, but no. You are talking about tax liability, showing monthly income has nothing to do with tax liability.
You are indeed a tax resident if you stay in Thailand for more than 183 years.
But I think you are also if you do NOT deposit that amount monthly.
The fact that you actually have to pay or not will then, I think, depend on a tax treaty or not. Well, I'm not an expert in this.
Just a loyal taxpayer in Belgium.
I've already written it.
If one really wants foreigners to pay taxes, then one could start taxing every “retired” who stays here longer than 183 on a flat rate of at least 800 Baht.
At the next renewal, it is very easy to check, via the passport, how long you were in Thailand in the last year. Those fixed taxes can then also be collected at the same time, possibly via a separate tax desk at immigration. First pay the tax, receive proof of payment and with that proof you can only apply for a next annual extension.
If you already pay taxes in Thailand, the issuing country or wherever, you just have to provide proof of this.
But I won't give any ideas to immigration and taxes in Thailand 😉
Well, I will not go into the whole tax story myself.
At some point you are done with it.
Especially since the story started because someone THINKS it MAYBE a way to collect taxes.
But in the end there is (currently anyway) no basis or substructure for it.
No one can see into the future and if anything ever changes in that direction, we'll see.
Have you ever been to the embassy of the country where your income comes from?
I don't know your whereabouts in Thailand; but have you ever been to the Consul of Austria with your proof of income?
And otherwise, as SteveNl already writes, there are still possibilities.
I already wrote in a previous comment.
https://www.thailandblog.nl/expats-en-pensionado/thaise-immigratie-bewijs-van-inkomen-2019/#comments
“The official text now also clearly states that the amount that is deposited must come from abroad (even overseas).
For those who already thought to just transfer it monthly from one account to another within Thailand ….
The deposit must therefore be made from abroad (even overseas)
https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/1076820-confirmed-here-is-exactly-what%E2%80%99s-needed-for-retirement-marriage-extensions-income-method-from-2019/
And why shouldn't the Consul of Pattaya be happy.
Nothing changes anyway. Those who previously went to him with their income can still continue to do so.
Only those who can no longer obtain proof of income from their embassy or those who want to can now also prove their income by making a monthly payment.
Read “Austrian Consul in Pattaya”.
Pattaya has no Consul of course 😉
indeed, forgot to type the Austrian.
And also sorry for my misinterpretation of the rules regarding the 65,000 baht. I did NOT read correctly that it only concerned those countries where no income letter is issued anymore.
bob,
I corrected myself about the “Consul of Pattaya” 😉
By the way, it is not only for those countries where no income letter is issued anymore, but everyone can use it.
Although it seems much easier to just go to your embassy if they deliver it, or use someone who also delivers it, such as the Austrian consul in Pattya
You are overlooking a few things:
1. That monthly 65.000 baht must come from abroad (and this must be apparent from your bank book/statements plus letter from the bank. Sending that amount back and forth every month is certainly not free.
2. If you are now using the visa support letter/income statement method, there is no reason to do what you suggest, because that method will not disappear.
Unfortunately this is not possible because you must prove that the 65.000 bath comes from the Netherlands and/or Belgium.
Just for my clarity:
I have 800000 baht in the bank every year. That is still possible?
Ja
Dear Ronnie
In last Monday's topic, you indicated that transfers with transferewise do not make it clear to immigration whether the money comes from an overseas source.
I always use transferwise and my online banking at Bankok Bank mentions International transfer, but no further information. In my opinion, this is clear that the money comes from outside. I don't know how this is with other banks of course.
regards George
Transferwise gives you the option of making a printout of the entire transfer, so the amount in euros, the exchange rate, the costs, the receiving bank, name and account number of the recipient.
For the Thai tax, I make a printout of the Dutch account of the pension received and transfer it to Transferwise, and I make a printout of the transfer to the Thai account from the Thai bank.
Is also completely understandable for immigration.
Yes and SteveNL also replied in a later response
“Transferwise is booked at Bangkok Bank as money from abroad, at the other banks as a domestic transaction.”
I replied to that
“So it is best to open an account with Bangkok Bank for those who want to use this method in the future.
Maybe I should do that because I regularly use Transferwise to transfer money. You never know that one day they will ask where my money comes from”
I'm at Kasikorn and SCB and you can't see that on the bank book there. You may then need to provide additional evidence.
I think so in the right side of the pass book there are 3 letters where the money comes from.
or not ?
Yes, but on my bank books (Kasikorn and SCB) the code does not show that the money comes from abroad.
At the Bangkok Bank apparently it is, but I have no experience with that myself.
You may then have to provide additional supporting documents.
It can possibly be stated on the bank letter, because you also need it from your bank.
But maybe they can't explain that because it's a domestic transfer for them.
(Transferwise transfers from domestic accounts. You can read it on their website)
I'm just stating this as something to keep in mind. It can save you an extra trip to immigration.
But if you think that the codes on your bank book say enough, or the bank states on its bank letter that the money does indeed come from abroad, then no problem.
Thank you for the answer!
You are indeed wrong Bob.
Nothing has changed in terms of Letter of Income for Thai Immigration.
To cater to residents of America, Australia, Great Britain, Denmark, the TI has provided an additional option : monthly transfers, but from abroad.
Residents of countries other than the four mentioned here can also use this extra option if desired.
Well,
Years ago (2011) I had printed out all page (24) of my Easy Pay account from the Siam Bank at home and went to the local office to verify it. The girl has stamped and signed each page. Total from the Netherlands more than 1 million Bhat.
And what do you think what the immigration in Laksi says;
No, we cannot accept that, you must have an income support letter from your embassy.
I say that this proves that I have 65.000 Bhat per month, but no.
Maybe now, we'll see.
Those were the regulations then, and stamped copies of bank deposits were not part of the supporting documents in 2011.
We are now 2019 and now the possibility of bank deposits does exist.
But are you now left with only stamped copies of your bank book, which must prove that a total of one million Baht has been deposited in a year, but that has not happened every month for at least 65 Baht (for example, 000 month has not been deposited or even only 1 Baht), then it may well be that the weather is not accepted…. and again asked to get a visa support letter.
After all, the 2019 regulations do not say how much you must deposit in a year in total, only that it must be at least 65 000 Baht per month (and not 60 000 one month and 70 000 Baht another month or any other combination).
And don't forget the bank letter. Stamped leaves are not the same.
Anyway. Maybe they'll accept it this time. That is then a decision of the IO.
General tip
Simply supplying what is asked, instead of deciding for yourself what you think they should accept, also solves many problems in immigration.
Hello.
Why not your pension via transferwise?
Is the best choice with highest highest exchange rates. Can be done from any Europe
se bank and costs you nothing.
“….cost you nothing”
??
And since when is Transferwise free?
Traansferwise works through a Thai bank relation that transfers the amount to your Thai account. The receiving banks see this as a domestic transaction, which is apparent from the coding in your bank book. In that case, Immigration will not accept the transaction.
Hi
I have a few questions regarding the new visa regulation for 2019.
I will first introduce my situation.
I am 55 years old and have been living in Thailand for almost 9 months now, I have a retired visa.
I'm not officially retired yet, so I don't get any monthly benefits from Belgium, but I have enough funds in excess of 1.000.000 baht in my account here in Thailand and have enough money in my account in Belgium.
My question is the following:
When I look at the new regulations for 2019, it says that you must transfer 65.000 bath monthly (in my case because I am not married to a Thai lady) from a foreign account to my account in Thailand.
What is the solution for me, since there will be no monthly benefit because I am not retired?
I can make monthly deposits from my account in Belgium to my Thai account.
Dear Guido,
I am surprised that you have been living in Thailand for 9 months, are in possession of a 'retired visa' and do not know that NOTHING will change for you. At your next annual renewal, you simply go to the bank and ask for a bank statement stating that you have 1.000.000THB in a bank deposit in your name. With that, plus a copy of that booklet, you go to immigration and you explain that for. You do NOT need all the other stuff of monthly transfers, affidavit…. The only thing you should also take with you is a copy of the bank book with which you do the transactions during the week. Just make sure, if you use the same bank account, that there is at least 3THB in that account 800.000 months before the year extension application. That's all, so this whole issue doesn't apply to you.
In recent months there have been several submissions about income and a retirement visa.
One says this, the other says something else.
The best solution is still for the Dutch Embassy to issue a visa support letter based on the verified income.
It is nice and nice if you have 800000 in the bank, but that says nothing at all about the monthly income.
You can have minimum wage.
It is also proof for the Thai Immigration that you have enough monthly income.
Now let's stop with all that speculation and wait for official statements from the Dutch Embassy and or Thai Immigration and not always write something that is not substantiated.
If anything changes, we will hear from the Embassy or Immigration.
Immigration is reported. You won't hear anything from the Dutch embassy, why should they, nothing will change.
There has indeed been a lot to be read and written about in recent months.
I kept saying that we should wait until official info came from immigration.
There is indeed no point in speculating.
But since a few days that official document of immigration has been there and you can already see it here. So it has nothing to do with speculation and is fully substantiated. So you are behind.
https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/1076820-confirmed-here-is-exactly-what%E2%80%99s-needed-for-retirement-marriage-extensions-income-method-from-2019/
By the way, it does not only concern “Retired”.
And with a bank amount of 800 Baht, nothing is wrong. Is a correct way to prove your finances.
Immigration does not require you to have sufficient income at all. It only requires that if you are going to use the income (or part of it) to meet the financial requirements of an annual extension, the amount you use is sufficient.
If you do not meet the required 65000 Baht with your income for “Retired”, you may supplement it with a bank amount. Nothing wrong with it.
Also someone with a minimum income, but who proves 800 000 Baht in the bank is completely fine for immigration. He does not have to prove any income at all and therefore does not need the embassy.
So speaking of substantiation….
I think, in my case I'm sure, that you should not have 2 accounts with the same bank. I wanted to move from one branch, bangkok bank, to another. First wanted to do this with my wife's account, could not, because she already had an account with credit card, etc. at the Bangkok bank. so cancel it first and then recreate it again at another branch. Today intermediate solution, I put an account and money on it, but no card. First cancel and then pick up a new card with a different account. When I, I know that an awful lot has been written about this, but still. I wanted to cancel my account at one office and open it at the other office, closer to home. That was not possible, I cannot open a new account or have to be in possession of a document from the Thai cosulate in Bangkok that gives permission that I MAY open an account in Thailand. According to the Bangkok bank employee, this new law is new since the beginning of this year. Again I know hundreds of different experiences have been posted here but I still want to share my experience in this one with you. My thing, just keep my account that I already own for 5 years and …. quietly have a beer.
Since we are moving from Bangkapi (Bangkok) to LatYa (Kanchanaburi), I also opened a new account in Kanchanaburi.
This went without any problems at the Kasikorn bank in Kanchanaburi. I did not have to close my other account with Kasikorn Bangkapi first.
By the way, I currently still have both accounts at both branches and each with an ATM card.
They also both appear on my online banking when I open it. Transferring from one to the other was then possible without any problems.
My wife also has an account with Kasikornbank. No problem. Never have to have a proof from the embassy.
I currently have no experience with Bangkok Bank.
But it must be the case that, just like with immigration, everyone follows their own rules.
Moreover, this was in November 2018 and it may well be that different rules apply for 2019.
Where is the “Thai cosulate in Bangkok” by the way? I'm assuming this is a slip 😉
Yes, it will be an excuse, but if you are there you can say that a consulate of Thailand only exists abroad, but even then…Fortunately not very important to me, but still. I think it is and remains the case that there is a certain form of arbitrariness. And unfortunately it remains a snapshot of when and with whom you enter the bank. Thank you for your response.
I can tell you with certainty that there is no such thing as a Thai Consulate IN Thailand.
Perhaps you should look up the purpose of a Consulate and the function of a Consul.
Dear, if you go into battle with an old points chef, he will not easily lose himself, although I think this is a waste of my time the following,
Maybe she meant this
Consular, go, th that looks like consulate when you sit on a chair at a couch right,
Here at this big office in Bangkok you have to get a stamp if you want to marry a foreigner as a Thai woman,
This “consulate” must also give a stamp if you want to work in Thailand and have a work visa
They also make passports for Thai people there
in short, it is one of the larger government buildings in Bangkok
And maybe the foreign people should open an account etc. etc., according to the lady at the counter. Not a top position and will certainly not be as smart as you, but I thought and I think it's worth telling the people on this blog.
Still best regards, rob
@Rob phitsanulok
There is no Thai consulate within Thailand, but there are ministries. You get stamps and such, depending on what it is for at home or foreign affairs, or the Ministry of Employment, not at a non-existent consulate.
I'm not afraid to go into battle with "old point cooks". On the contrary.
That is just the link to the Foreign Affairs website, ie the “Ministry of foreign Affairs. A government institution that just about everyone knows.
But let it be clear that this is not a Thai Consulate at all. A Thai Consulate does NOT exist in Thailand.
But Consulates and Embassies do fall under the supervision of the MFA.
And consular matters can usually be handled at the MFA, as well as at Embassies or Consulates. That is broadly speaking
But since it's a waste of your time, don't let me disturb you any further.
True and if you read carefully… I never said that about that consulate but that lady on the couch, which I have already said could also be a mistranslation or interpretation. Your first reaction was very good, but unfortunately it got worse after that. The fact remains that you often provide very useful information. What thanks.
I can read quite well..... but I won't disturb you any longer because it's a waste of your time.
You are indeed allowed to have 2 accounts with the same bank, and there are no new rules for this.
It will not be easy to get documents at the Thai consulate in Bangkok, because there is no Thai consulate in Bangkok.
See comment above, thanks for advice, regards, Rob
Dear Bob, You said it yourself: different experiences everywhere. I do have 2 accounts with the Bangkok Bank, actually 3. I also have a Euro account, but it is largely checked by the head office in Bangkok. The transfer from the Netherlands takes 2 days, the bank book can be updated here in Huahin, but a new one must come from Bangkok!!!
With your story I think it concerns 2 accounts but with a different branch of the same bank and yes that could be true that that is not possible. By the way, I wouldn't worry too much about it. I really do almost everything with internet banking and rarely go to the bank and then usually only for a new book.
Thanks for the response, I also think that you should not have 2 accounts at 2 different branches at the Bangkok bank. Fortunately we don't have to worry about it, but thought the experience was worth sharing. It remains strange that the various branches of a bank still operate fairly independently.
I wish them good luck and go have a drink without permission from a consul??? In Bangkok.