Reader question: Renew Belgian passport
January 25 2017
Dear readers,
We live in Thailand for 4 years. I regularly go back and forth to Belgium. Now my daughter 16 years young and myself want to go to Belgium for a month around March, April. My daughter has two nationalities, Belgian and Thai, we are still registered in Belgium and have a reference address there.
Now our problem: my daughter's Belgian passport has expired, but her Thai passport has not. We cannot renew the Belgian passport in Thailand if we are still registered in Belgium, so it can only be renewed at the town hall of our reference address.
How do we get out of the country and back in?
hoped op antwoord
Greetings
Alex & Emma
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A reference address is normally prohibited. Can only be used in certain professions.
Just lose your passport in Thailand and apply for a new one?
A passport that has expired no longer exists. Under strict legal conditions, you cannot travel to a country where the passport has expired.
It is indeed the case that the Belgian passport can only be renewed in the Belgian municipality where you are still registered.
A Thai (your daughter) does not need to have a Belgian passport to travel to Belgium.
She can -in my opinion- apply for a visa at the embassy of Belgium in Bangkok to travel to Belgium (I presume in your company). She will probably have to designate a person who will take on the guarantee for unforeseen expenses that she would incur in Belgium or if she falls ill and cannot pay the costs. For example, many Thais travel to Belgium for a short period (up to 3 months).
You will (as guarantor) have to sign a document that you guarantee for all costs it would cause.
Once in Belgium, your daughter can apply for a new Belgian passport (3 weeks waiting time or a few days if a substantial amount has to be paid).
With the new passport (now valid for 7 years) and the still valid Thai passport, she can travel back to Thailand.
Maybe I'm overlooking something, but I've experienced this procedure several times with Thai acquaintances.
Hope it will help you.
Greetings,
As a European I am a bit surprised. Daughter has Belgian nationality, so she is a national of Belgium. Just go to the Belgian embassy and ask for a travel document to replace the expired passport. If you need to apply for a new passport in Belgium, the embassy will still have to cooperate to get there. Compare it with a stolen or lost passport, then the embassy will also have to issue an emergency document so that you can travel back to Belgium.
Why take the difficult route of a visa. After all, she also has the Belgian nationality.
Hi Jean
My daughter is not Thai, was born in Belgium, the mother is Thai
Your daughter leaves Thailand with her unexpired Thai passport and enters Belgium with her Belgian E-ID,
She leaves Belgium with her Belgian E-ID and enters Thailand with her Thai passport,
The only thing that can be difficult to do is an airline check-in counter, but then she shows either her Belgian E-ID or Thai passport,
Thousands of dual national Thais (including my wife for 32 years) do it this way,
So nothing to worry about
She may not show her Belgian E-ID to Thai immigration and vice versa in Belgium,
no problem…you take the old passport with you to the Belgian embassy…they immediately issue a provisional passport (valid for 1 year)…costs little and your daughter can apply for a new passport in Belgium…did it myself for wife and two children last year .
Jean Paul ..will only be done if your address is here ..probably your address is here ?…or else the legislation has changed but they don't give a passport anymore informed by phone ..not even for now
You are not in order without a visit to the Belgian embassy for the necessary documents.
Are you registered at the embassy? If you are registered at the embassy, I believe you should be able to renew your passport there. But I think registration is mandatory.
If you regularly travel back and forth, I think it is wiser to ensure that your passport only expires after returning to the country of the passport.
Maybe your daughter has a valid Belgian ID card. Then she can use it together with her Thai passport to come back to Belgium. Then you can of course also immediately apply for a new passport in your municipality. Actually, I can hardly imagine that she only has a Belgian passport and no Belgian ID card…
Contact the Belgian embassy in Bangkok or send them an email with your questions.
Also have a look at this website: http://diplomatie.belgium.be/nl
Good luck!
Daniel, again my daughter was born in Belgium and is Belgian, at birth, 16 years ago the mother and I gave her 2 nationalities at the embassy in Brussels, so she has a valid ID card and is still in order with everything such as sick phone and of such
Dear Alex,
My wife is Thai. She has a Thai passport, a Thai ID card and a Belgian F-ID card. When she checks in at the airport in Thailand to fly to Belgium, she shows her Thai passport and Belgian F-ID card. At immigration (still in Thailand) the same (maybe her Thai ID card too). Her Belgian (F-)ID card also serves as a visa to fly to Belgium.
During passport control in Belgium, she shows her Belgian (F-)ID card and her Thai passport.
I believe this situation is similar to your daughter's. So I think your daughter can go to Belgium without any problems on presentation of her Thai passport in combination with her Belgian or Thai ID card.
If you are then in Belgium, you can apply for a new Belgian passport without any problems. If your stay is too short, you can have it done via the urgent procedure, but that is a lot more expensive…
The only problem I can think of now is that your daughter's name is not written the same on her different IDs... It may seem impossible to most, but administratively you can't rule anything out and you have to check everything carefully. But otherwise I don't see any problems.
But again, contact the embassy to be sure.
A quick search gives me the following result:
This is on http://diplomatie.belgium.be/nl/Diensten/Diensten_in_het_buitenland/Belgisch_paspoort:
Belgian passport
You live abroad and you have a question about services and documents for Belgians abroad: first consult the website of the local Belgian embassy or consulate. It provides answers that take specific account of your own operations in the country where you live. If you have any questions, you can also contact the embassy or consulate directly.
The passport is an officially recognized and usable travel document in the form of a booklet issued worldwide by a country to its nationals.
The passport should not be confused with the identity card which – as the name suggests – consists of only one card.
A Belgian passport is valid for 7 years (5 years for minors).
From birth, every Belgian can get his own passport.
With an identity card you can travel to about 50 countries.
The passport allows you to travel to all countries in the world, if necessary after obtaining the required visa.
Search result
Embassy Bangkok
16/F Sathorn Square – 98 North Sathorn Road – Silom Sub-District, Bangrak District
110500Bangkok
Hailand
Opening hours and closing days
Diplomatic Department
Monday to Friday: 08.00:12.00 – XNUMX:XNUMX*
Monday to Thursday: 13.00 pm – 16.00 pm*
Friday: 13.00 – 14.00*
Consular section (assistance to Belgians, population service)
Monday to Friday: 08.00:12.00 – XNUMX:XNUMX* (free access without appointment)
Monday to Thursday: 13.00:15.00 – XNUMX:XNUMX (by appointment only)
Friday: 13.00:14.00 – XNUMX:XNUMX (by appointment only
Visa Department
Only by appointment! (see http://thailand.diplomatie.belgium.be/nl/naar-belgie-komen/visum-voor-belgie)
Monday to Friday: 08.00:12.00 – XNUMX:XNUMX
Monday to Thursday: 13.00:15.00 – XNUMX:XNUMX
Friday: 13.00 – 14.00
*Unless you have an appointment, the access badges at the reception on the ground floor will be reduced to 15 minutes before closing time.
Ambassador Philippe KRIDELKA
+66 2 108 18 00
+66 2 108 18 07
+66 2 108 18 08
+66 81 833 99 87 (Outside opening hours and only in case of emergency)
[email protected]
[email protected] For visa applicants
http://diplomatie.belgium.be/thailand/
http://www.facebook.com/BelgiumInThailand
Report lost passport and ask for a "laissez passer" document at the Belgian embassy, which allows you to travel only to Belgium, maybe this is also possible if the passport has simply expired ..?
B) leave with a Thai passport for your daughter and arrival Use a Belgian identity card for entry? You will also not be refused entry on arrival as a Belgian national for that expired passport …, possibly only a reprimand or a fine
According to some reactions: “no problem at all: just go to the embassy and say that she has lost her passport”… they are not stupid at the embassy and it concerns a minor!
Worst case scenario, you're getting a decent amount of trouble on your head. Neither you nor your daughter are registered at the Belgian embassy as you write it yourself. Since 2015, the embassy has been instructed to only deliver documents for “registered” Belgians and to help Belgians “in need”. That's their job anyway. Going to tell that your daughter has lost her passport is actually pointless because the first thing they will ask is a document from the police reporting the loss. If you have a copy of the 'lost' passport, they immediately see that it is an expired passport and you are lying. Since a lost or stolen passport has to be rendered useless so that it cannot be misused by the finder or the thief, it is a breeze to find out which passport it was, where and when by entering the name of the rightful holder. it was issued…. Since your daughter is a minor, she needs your signature, and probably both parents, to get a new one. You will therefore have to provide evidence that it is indeed your daughter because she is a minor. Then it immediately comes to light that you have been living in Thailand for 4 years and have not been deregistered or registered. Reason… you must have a reason…. 6 months of absence means a legal obligation to report, 1 year means a legal obligation to deregister …. and so on… if they want to be difficult and also want to act correctly, they can do that very easily and you don't even have a leg to stand on.
The least risk of big problems is applying for a visa for your underage daughter and that too will not be obvious that it will be granted without the necessary paperwork. I wish you the best of luck and let us know how it all went.
Damn! I hadn't thought of that! Lung addie, your comment does indeed make me think.
But who's to say the mother isn't coming? If the mother does go, then I don't think there is a problem.
I read in the question that the girl has a valid Belgian ID card, a valid Thai ID card and a valid Thai passport.
If you go to the embassy with a valid Belgian ID card, they can still look up whether that person also has a passport on the basis of the national register number stated on the ID card, and if so, when it expires or expired. This question will have to go from the embassy via Brussels and then it may take a while before the answer is known at the embassy. A second visit to the embassy may then be required.
I assume Alex knows that too. I also mentioned in my response of 25.01.2017 that you must be registered at the embassy. If that hasn't already happened, I think Alex can still do that, together with his daughter and maybe also with the mother.
In principle, the Belgian ID card serves as a visa, and the Thai passport and ID card for identification and for identity checks. Strictly speaking, I believe that Alex's daughter has sufficient documentation.
Proof of kinship is something else. If both parents are traveling along, there probably won't be a problem. If only the father travels, the mother's written consent is required. This permission must be legalized in the municipality or at the embassy (to be inquired at the embassy). Maybe the mother should be there too. Indeed, a major problem can arise if the mother refuses or is 'unable' to give her consent.
I am not going to comment on the obligation to report, the obligation to deregister, etc., because nothing has been said about this in the question. But I think it's very good that you mention this in your response.
It is now up to Alex, based on the information he is given, to decide how to solve 'his problems'.
improvement/nuance:
“…if the mother is 'unable'…”
please read/interpret this as:
“… if the mother is not there (e.g. untraceable, deceased, …) …”
@Daniel M.
do you think that one can “just” register at the embassy? Just walk in there and say, here I am, I'm in trouble and come quickly register me so you have to help me out of trouble. This is NOT possible because you need the “deregistration document, the so-called 'Model 8'”. You will receive this from the municipality where you are deregistered and with which you can then register at the embassy. Not deregistered = not to be registered! You can't do that without the Model 8.
I wrote a complete “deregistration file for Belgians” and published it on this blog… did I end up doing all that work for NOTHING?
PS apparently the mother is not going along, according to what the questioner writes. So it won't just run smoothly because realize that there is a "minor" involved.
I foresee problems at the embassy because there is fraud in this case.
If the girl is registered in Belgium, but actually lives in Thailand, this will surface.
In the Netherlands this is punishable by law, because in this way people accrue state pension from the age of 18 and are insured free of charge for medical expenses for the parent living in the Netherlands.
The Belgian embassy in Bangkok no longer issues new passes to compatriots and no provisional ones either. What they do do is provide a day document so that you can enter the country without any problems, here you do not actually need it.
They do make new passes when you live here .
You can keep your address in Belgium if you go back there every 6 months …
In the past you could ask the family to go to town hall for you for an application, but now the fingerprint of the applicant is required.
It is best to wait until you are almost going to Belgium and before the departure you go to the embassy for your document.. good luck!
Alex please contact us by email please… [email protected]
Poo & Ronny
Poo probably means: the country, in this case Thailand, can OUT and cannot IN.
They do make new passes if you live here…. this must be: if you are REGISTERED here and therefore UNSUBSCRIBED in Belgium. Living here is not enough, you must be registered here at the embassy and that is only possible if you are deregistered in Belgium. You need the relevant Model 8 document for registration (deregistration document issued by the municipality that deregisters you. )
You may even be absent from Belgium for up to 1 year without losing your address, provided that you inform the population service of your place of residence in advance. with all reasons, tourism is also a reason, have done this for 3 years, provided 1 return to Belgium annually, address is retained, this counts in all municipalities in Belgium (Fgov. rule)
https://www.sint-truiden.be/tijdelijke-afwezigheid
The laissez passer is the document that is delivered at all times to entitled Belgians (exception in this case, the mother's permission is probably required because of a minor ..) for this you do not have to be registered at the embassy, we are Belgian ..!!